I looked up "Japanese" at urbandictionary.com and.

Posted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 10:35 pm Post subject: Post Rating: 0

"Also, I find it uneccasary for the Prime Minister of Japan to go pay respects to soldiers of Japan's WWII army. This would be like saying the president of German going to pay respects to Hitler."
No, it is nothing like paying respects to Hitler. It's more like the war memorial in Washington paying respects to American soldiers who died in Vietnam in a war that was wrong, where they had no business being. Most soldiers have no choice in what they do or where they get sent, or the war they fight in. And they do bad things too. Paying respects to men who died in a war is something that every country tries to do, otherwise the poor guys are just cannon fodder, no more important than a bullet.
I find it incredible that the Chinese government demonstrates such breathtaking hypocrisy in the way it portrays its own recent history, just as much as I deplore the Japanese governments failure to admit that the past happened. But then, we have people wanting apolgies for things that happened literally hundreds of years ago, that my ancestors may or may not have had any clue about, and that is just ludicrous, when do you stop blaming a nation, how long is enough? For some people a couple of thousand years isn't enough to let it go.
The most important thing is that even if Japan doesn't want to face up to the horrors of what they did in the second world war, they have evolved so far away from that now that you have to applaud them for it. Trying to demonise the ordinary folks of Japan for what happened then is wasting time and effort. Making racist comments about any nation is how wars start, not trying to forget what happened in a previous war. No doubt some will disagree and see that every single thing that any nation ever did wrong should never be forgotten, but look backwards all the time, instead of facing problems that the world has right now, is pretty pointless!

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 1:55 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

Okay, well logically speaking:
1) Out of all the protestors who completely abhor Japan, how many of them are actually so mentally impaired that they cannot carry on with their lives? Perhaps some comfort women, perhaps some of the people of the older generation, but the majority of the protestors (99%+) probably haven't even had a relationship with a Japanese person in their entire life.

2) Why does the Chinese government encourage demonizing Japan?
Well..
a) the communist party there is beginning to lose its grip over China. Hence, it needs a scapegoat (i.e. Japan) to feed their country's nationalistic identity.
b) it all comes down to outright envy, China enjoyed its moment of glory when Japan lost face after the war, when Hirohito had to claim in public that he was not a divine being, when China was made a permanent member of the UN... but then, soon, Japan modernized (which Japan's proven to be extraordinarily capable of, especially if you look at the bakufu -> meiji era as well), and then Japan possessed a dynamite economy while China was in shambles after a series of civil wars.

3) Why continue?
a) Throughout its history, China's had a peasant revolt every 40 or so years. Well, they're overdue by... about 20. I'm not going to make a prophecy that a peasant revolt will happen, but hey, if the entire nation was burning with revenge for Japan (no pun intended for those who watched Chinese demonstrators burning Japanese flags), then, odds are, the Chinese are probably not going to question their government sometime soon.

4) What will happen if China continues, or expands its hostility against Japan?
a) Well, if China continues its rise it will soon be irrelevant. Already, a great number of people who originally sympathized with China are getting a signal in their brains going, "wait a minute, first there's a few tragic stories from people who've lived through it all, and yes, I've shed a few years for them. Then they asked for repatriations- okay, sure, they got that, so now... all should be well, right? Whoah, hold on a sec, what's this? Protestors burning flags? Hmm..."

Maybe I'm just too nationalistic about Japan. However, when I see my country's flag being burnt, I take that as an insult equal to being pissed on my face. No joke. No exaggerations. To all you Americans reading this thread, how would you feel if Native Americans living on reservations decided to have a get-together and burn American flags? I'd bet over half of you will go, "well, they've got a right to do whatever, and sure, we did some horrible things to them long ago, but damn, that's REALLY insulting. Almost as if they're calling for a war."

---wait a sec. A war?
hmm.......

okay well, this is the algorithym that just happened in my mind for those of you who were puzzled:
1) Chinese demonstrators burn our flags
2) I, as a Japanese person who's done nothing wrong to them and have lived in America for the major portion of my life, feel insulted.
3) I try to put myself in a Chinese person's perspective
4) I wonder what the Chinese demonstrator is trying to say by burning our flag
5) I give myself a multiple choice question:
is it...
a. They are burning our flags because they are genuinely protesting Japanese atrocities
b. They are burning our flags because they are jealous of Japanese economy
c. They are burning our flags because they've been brain-washed by the government
d. They are burning our flags because they want to spark a war

Oddly enough, I found myself agreeing with all of my answers that popped into my head.

Sure, it may be pointless to talk about this here, and I doubt our debates will alter the course of the relationships between Japan and China, but hey, as d-addict members, and lovers of Asian culture, I think this is a big issue that we should try and put some logic to.

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:11 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

Okay, well logically speaking:
1) Out of all the protestors who completely abhor Japan, how many of them are actually so mentally impaired that they cannot carry on with their lives? Perhaps some comfort women, perhaps some of the people of the older generation, but the majority of the protestors (99%+) probably haven't even had a relationship with a Japanese person in their entire life.

2) Why does the Chinese government encourage demonizing Japan?
Well..
a) the communist party there is beginning to lose its grip over China. Hence, it needs a scapegoat (i.e. Japan) to feed their country's nationalistic identity.
b) it all comes down to outright envy, China enjoyed its moment of glory when Japan lost face after the war, when Hirohito had to claim in public that he was not a divine being, when China was made a permanent member of the UN... but then, soon, Japan modernized (which Japan's proven to be extraordinarily capable of, especially if you look at the bakufu -> meiji era as well), and then Japan possessed a dynamite economy while China was in shambles after a series of civil wars.

3) Why continue?
a) Throughout its history, China's had a peasant revolt every 40 or so years. Well, they're overdue by... about 20. I'm not going to make a prophecy that a peasant revolt will happen, but hey, if the entire nation was burning with revenge for Japan (no pun intended for those who watched Chinese demonstrators burning Japanese flags), then, odds are, the Chinese are probably not going to question their government sometime soon.

4) What will happen if China continues, or expands its hostility against Japan?
a) Well, if China continues its rise it will soon be irrelevant. Already, a great number of people who originally sympathized with China are getting a signal in their brains going, "wait a minute, first there's a few tragic stories from people who've lived through it all, and yes, I've shed a few years for them. Then they asked for repatriations- okay, sure, they got that, so now... all should be well, right? Whoah, hold on a sec, what's this? Protestors burning flags? Hmm..."

Maybe I'm just too nationalistic about Japan. However, when I see my country's flag being burnt, I take that as an insult equal to being pissed on my face. No joke. No exaggerations. To all you Americans reading this thread, how would you feel if Native Americans living on reservations decided to have a get-together and burn American flags? I'd bet over half of you will go, "well, they've got a right to do whatever, and sure, we did some horrible things to them long ago, but damn, that's REALLY insulting. Almost as if they're calling for a war."

---wait a sec. A war?
hmm.......

okay well, this is the algorithym that just happened in my mind for those of you who were puzzled:
1) Chinese demonstrators burn our flags
2) I, as a Japanese person who's done nothing wrong to them and have lived in America for the major portion of my life, feel insulted.
3) I try to put myself in a Chinese person's perspective
4) I wonder what the Chinese demonstrator is trying to say by burning our flag
5) I give myself a multiple choice question:
is it...
a. They are burning our flags because they are genuinely protesting Japanese atrocities
b. They are burning our flags because they are jealous of Japanese economy
c. They are burning our flags because they've been brain-washed by the government
d. They are burning our flags because they want to spark a war

Oddly enough, I found myself agreeing with all of my answers that popped into my head.

Sure, it may be pointless to talk about this here, and I doubt our debates will alter the course of the relationships between Japan and China, but hey, as d-addict members, and lovers of Asian culture, I think this is a big issue that we should try and put some logic to.

*Note* I'm not taking sides, cuz that would be ridiculous. The entire thing is completely irrational and its mostly politics.

Oh, Japan "does" gloss Nanjing. But China also glosses Japanese apologies. Startled? Well take a look here for a full list of Japanese apologies:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_war_apology_statements_issued_by_Japan

To summarize it in one sentence: "It's just bickering."

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:42 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:50 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:55 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

i havent got the time to read this whole thread, but i think that we should all stop bashing everyone's country/heirtage for being racist, burnign flags,or glossing over facts, and realize that every country has done something wrong and it is up to us to change this.

if you want people in future generations to realize what horrible things have happend, then mabye we should tell them ourselves, instead of saying "oh this book doesn't mention such and such incident, therefore no one will ever know about it".

sorry if my post is not clear enough, but hopefully the message will get through.

^^

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:55 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0

Posted: Mon Feb 06, 2006 2:59 am Post subject: Post Rating: 0