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A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

The real life drama forum. Discuss your relationships or get to know the other members here.
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Valcun
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A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by Valcun » Jan 28th, '06, 00:06

Follow your Heart :)

Its so simple that people seem to overlook it as "Cheesy" or "Stupid. But its true. The answer for EVERYTHING Lies within. The Wizard of Oz was a good movie. If you looked, the tin man wanted to have a heart. But in reality, he had one the whole time. Just like dorthy, she had the power to go home the whole time, But she didn't realize it till later.

I have my share of expeirence. I use to be REALLY good with women. I knew what lines to say and how to act to make them flabbergasted. But in reality, rushing love turns into false love. Which later turns to false sex. So to the guys who went out w/ a girl to just sleep w/ her, thats false love. Sure it feels good, but its wrong and its not as good as if it is with someone you Love. I Gave up the "GAME" and the Seduction community so that is in the past. The answer for making a girl like you is to follow your heart. Don't surpress it and think with your intellect. Whats feels so good about being able to follow your heart is that your able to truely Smile :)

The answer you seek, has been with you the WHOLE time. All you needed to do was look inside your self for it :)

If you get rejected its okay, she wasn't for you :).


FOLLOW YOUR HEART AND YOU WILL NEVER GO WRONG!!! XD !!!!!!!!!!!!

MINA-SAN!!!! GANBATTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! XD XD XD XD !!!!!!

Moenyc2000
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Post by Moenyc2000 » Jan 28th, '06, 08:14

LOL, with that sort of advice, all the guys will be single for the rest of their lives. I suggest you read double your dating, by David D. Perhaps your watching too many K-Dramas'? :lol

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Valcun
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Post by Valcun » Jan 28th, '06, 09:15

You didnt read the rest of the post did you? I use to be a PUA you RAFC. I have all of it. Mystery Method, Real Social Dynamics, David De Angelo.

Its The GAME and PUA Seduction society that sickens me. I learned the truth. You are being sucked in a hole my friend.

Scandalous
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Post by Scandalous » Jan 28th, '06, 09:48

Valcun wrote:You didnt read the rest of the post did you? I use to be a PUA you RAFC. I have all of it. Mystery Method, Real Social Dynamics, David De Angelo.

Its The GAME and PUA Seduction society that sickens me. I learned the truth. You are being sucked in a hole my friend.
Hmmm...ur 18, and u already got the game down solid??? no offense buddy, but from the sound of ur previous posts, ur still definitely confused. IMO, experience b4 the age of 18 is still puppy love. Give it another decade or so, and perhaps ur impressions of relationships will be different. :salut:

Moenyc2000
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Post by Moenyc2000 » Jan 28th, '06, 09:49

Lol, I was thinking the same thing when he wrote his meticulous argument on how he has the love game figured out. When I was 18, wow!, my views had drastically changed after experiencing 4 years of college.

kotaeshiranaihito
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Re: A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Jan 28th, '06, 16:38

Funny, my views changed after only one year of college.

I do agree with one part of his rant though.
Valcun wrote: If you get rejected its okay, she wasn't for you :).
Probably the hardest part meeting and dating is not feeling like a loser when you get rejected (and trust me you will get rejected a few times no matter who you are), and just moving on to someone else like it was nothing at all.

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Valcun
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Post by Valcun » Jan 28th, '06, 19:00

Having routines is something pre-made. In my opinion, your looking for false love and false sex. I don't like the game. Its just a coporation now days. Trust + Comfort = Sex = Stupid. But it is true. Dont you read your material? Look at what happen to Sweater. He almost committed suicide because he was acting someone he wasn't. I rather be my self than be my alter ego when Im gaming. Portray your personality on them, not someone your not. I started the game to find love. All I got was hot chicks to like me. All of them whom which I have no "real" connection. As talking in social aspect. You are correct. I am still maturing and learning. On the other hand, picking up girls around my age is easy because they are not socialized yet. But I always had a tendency to like older women anyway before the game. Thats why I taught some of my closest friends who are girls the Game. So they dont get picked up by cheesy guys like u :P. The game consumes you and your life. So STOP TRYING to RUSH LOVE. It EXISTS.

The Only ADVANTAGE of the Game is becoming more of a Social Person. Other than that it is BAD!

Scandalous
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Post by Scandalous » Jan 29th, '06, 09:09

Valcun wrote:Having routines is something pre-made. In my opinion, your looking for false love and false sex. I don't like the game. Its just a coporation now days. Trust + Comfort = Sex = Stupid.

The Only ADVANTAGE of the Game is becoming more of a Social Person. Other than that it is BAD!
Game = Corporation??? LoL, interesting...basically u can almost compare LIFE in general as a big game. Like u said, playing with girls is a totally different game than playing with women. From ur posts it seems that u were a victim of this LOVE GAME of urs. U emphasize a lot about ur skills however the whole tone of ur post totally directs to the fact u got ur ass played...no offense buddy, but its a good lesson in life.

The other part 'bout u teachin' ur GAME to ur chick friends so they won't be played is totally offside. Regardless of how much u teach them, guys have the ability to improvise and r aware of guys like u whom try to do a good thing. U should know cuz u r a GUY too. Its all good warn ur chick friends about us so called, "DOGS" but, in the end r u really helping ur friends? its heartless to say, but chicks need to go through a few bad boys to gain insight. :salut:

aznsixiang
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Post by aznsixiang » Jan 29th, '06, 09:26

Scandalous wrote:its heartless to say, but chicks need to go through a few bad boys to gain insight. :salut:
i agree because no matter how you say it, experience is still the best teacher of them all. Saying a bunch of stuff to someone about something as complicated as this is pretty useless. These type of relationships are pretty much built on on the spot improvising and talking simply about it without being able to impart real understanding of the mechanics of it isn't enough.

Mattman
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Post by Mattman » Jan 29th, '06, 22:35

A guide on making girls like you.....
Isn't that cloning?

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Atomic
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Post by Atomic » Jan 29th, '06, 22:46

Moenyc2000 wrote:LOL, with that sort of advice, all the guys will be single for the rest of their lives. I suggest you read double your dating, by David D. Perhaps your watching too many K-Dramas'? :lol
100% agree. You might as well just join the priest hood cause the chances of getting a chick by "following your heart" is like winning the lottery..

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Mythrel
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Post by Mythrel » Jan 30th, '06, 04:57

I like how people can view love and experiences through books and then turn around and are shocked at a concept of ones heart. Like the heart is something that is unnatural. Oh well no point trying to explain it, the concept is too complex for some apparently.

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milleu87
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Post by milleu87 » Jan 30th, '06, 05:22

i'm confuse by his post. i don't really get what he is saying. Find true love? don't give up true love? he experience the whole routine thing? he didn't really like the teen type of thing?

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bugsie
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Re: A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by bugsie » Jan 30th, '06, 05:26

Valcun wrote: FOLLOW YOUR HEART AND YOU WILL NEVER GO WRONG!!! XD !!!!!!!!!!!!!
here's an idea, "follow your mom and you will never go wrong".

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Rice
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Re: A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by Rice » Jan 30th, '06, 05:36

Valcun wrote:Follow your Heart :)

FOLLOW YOUR HEART AND YOU WILL NEVER GO WRONG!!! XD !!!!!!!!!!!!

MINA-SAN!!!! GANBATTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! XD XD XD XD !!!!!!
I think I am the only one who understands what Valcun is trying to say :mrgreen: .
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arcanejane
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Post by arcanejane » Jan 30th, '06, 05:54

you can't make girls like you. Sometimes you click with someone and sometimes you dont. The best thing you can do is be who you are, be considerate of both your feelings and person you are aiming for, be honest with them and hope for the best.
sure there all sorts of different methods of picking people up or how to act in a relationship, but if that isnt who you really are then its hopeless anyway right?

susuking
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Post by susuking » Jan 30th, '06, 06:09

is there a guide? there is no guide, just do what u feel is right. and what game? i hate guys who view girls that way, even though i have no idea why girls says that i'm a player when i'm just saying what they want to hear...

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ryuushin
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Re: A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by ryuushin » Feb 3rd, '06, 22:15

Valcun wrote:Follow your Heart :)

Its so simple that people seem to overlook it as "Cheesy" or "Stupid. But its true. The answer for EVERYTHING Lies within. The Wizard of Oz was a good movie. If you looked, the tin man wanted to have a heart. But in reality, he had one the whole time. Just like dorthy, she had the power to go home the whole time, But she didn't realize it till later.

I have my share of expeirence. I use to be REALLY good with women. I knew what lines to say and how to act to make them flabbergasted. But in reality, rushing love turns into false love. Which later turns to false sex. So to the guys who went out w/ a girl to just sleep w/ her, thats false love. Sure it feels good, but its wrong and its not as good as if it is with someone you Love. I Gave up the "GAME" and the Seduction community so that is in the past. The answer for making a girl like you is to follow your heart. Don't surpress it and think with your intellect. Whats feels so good about being able to follow your heart is that your able to truely Smile :)

The answer you seek, has been with you the WHOLE time. All you needed to do was look inside your self for it :)

If you get rejected its okay, she wasn't for you :).


FOLLOW YOUR HEART AND YOU WILL NEVER GO WRONG!!! XD !!!!!!!!!!!!

MINA-SAN!!!! GANBATTE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! XD XD XD XD !!!!!!
Wow.. well let me start off first that i agree with him in some aspects, because everyone is giving him all negative responses.

First the whole game thing.. ok i agree in the sense that yes there are some players out there that just want women for sex and think its just a game to hurt them but enjoy it while doing that. I have a friend that does that, i get pissed at him for doing that especially if he hurts my friends. The only reason i still consider him as a friend is because he's been there through thick and thin with me , undergoing many aspects of life. Anyways back on topic, Following your heart does not work for everyone why? because society advances everyday, through media (television, radio, Movies, books) and we all learn some key aspects like respect, generosity, compassion, trust, loyalty and etc..

The world is unfair, but to make it fair you need to realize what you can change and what you can do to make it better for you. We all have our own tragedy's some may be worst then others but we all have them. Some are rich some are poor and it kinda affects our relationships.

But there is no real guide to getting women/girls or w/e you want to call them. We treat women with respect and compassion and thats what they really love. Just be yourself but sometimes you have to change alittle , such as the way you dress infront of her, the way you talk, but not to the extent that you go through so many hardships just to be with her, she will like you for who you are, and not what you've become.

Lies, betrayal are very harsh things but if you can really prove it to her that you care or love her she would understand. And the phrase about crying. A man is never worth your tears.. thats BS and everyone knows that. People cry all the time , but as long as you share the hardships together, then thats what counts. You all know the marriage proposal most of that is true.

Anyways to end it off You can't make a guide for something that is always changing, A guide to writing an essay you take key components, a guide on how to play an instrument same thing, but a guide to how you want to live life, how you want to impress a girl, how you want to be no#1 and etc.. those are not guides but rather those are experiences people go through and each experience is similar but also different in every way.

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archs13
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Post by archs13 » Feb 4th, '06, 05:25

arcanejane wrote:you can't make girls like you. Sometimes you click with someone and sometimes you dont. The best thing you can do is be who you are, be considerate of both your feelings and person you are aiming for, be honest with them and hope for the best.
sure there all sorts of different methods of picking people up or how to act in a relationship, but if that isnt who you really are then its hopeless anyway right?
yeah i think that's true with the making girls like you thing.. i had a blind date with this one girl and she was cute and she's a backup singer in her college band and i thought i wouldnt have a chance on her liking me.. but then it was like a snap on a finger and that was it..

maybe poking her on the side of the stomach (she did that to me and i was hekka shocked ha ha!) could help he he.. jok, i guess just be yourself and dont act fake cause you want her to like you

ryobreak
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Post by ryobreak » Feb 4th, '06, 05:39

I'm gonna have to disagree.
Try reading some of Azreal

Code: Select all

Death of a Nice Guy 
By: Azrael 
Women are always saying how they want a nice guy…someone who will open up to them, spend time with them, do nice things for them, in general, be there for them. 

Bullshit. 

Next time I hear that from a woman, I will say exactly that. Bullshit. Because you don't want the nice guys. Sure, you can say you do all you want, and maybe you can trick yourself into believing it too. But the truth is - you want the jerks. You want the guys who show an interest in you, then back off for no apparent reason. You want the guys who don't call you for two weeks, and when they do they swear up and down they're committed to you. You want the ones who don't talk to you, don't open up at all (and you want to change them to boot!) If you do find a nice guy, you make sure he's unattainable. He has a girlfriend, or he's gay, or he doesn't want a relationship at all. Basically, you want what you can't have. 

You know how I know this? I used to be a nice guy. Yeah, I'm the one you always come running to when the jerks screw you over. I listen to your problems, I offer advice. Like all nice guys before me, and the countless ones after, I'm always there to back you up. I tell you how pretty you are. I tell you how fun it is to spend time with you, how cool you are, how you deserve great things. You say thanks, briefly, and then continue to rant about Jerk #2873. 

I tell you over and over that you deserve a better guy, and there's always that "but…". Then you call me up at 1 in the morning some night just to tell me how he finally called you after two weeks, and how happy it's made you. You make excuses for why he's been ignoring you. You make more plans to change him. "If." And, do you know what the worst part is? This is the guy you're attracted to. This is the guy you're willing to get physical with. This is the guy you're willing to lose your virginity to. You make a big deal about how you're not a slut, and you won't just kiss any guy. But you admit that you would go all the way with this guy. Or you want to. Or, you already have. 

No, you don't want a nice guy. And don't give me that bullshit about "a good man is hard to find." There are millions of them out there. Probably hundreds around where you live. And I'm willing to bet you know a few. You know that guy you call at any hour at night to talk about your relationship triumphs/problems? The one who always compliments you, makes you feel better about yourself? Is always willing to drop whatever he's doing to satisfy your needs? 

What about him? No, of course not him. He's not enough of a jerk for you. 

And the worst part? You don't want him now…but you will. When you get older, oh, say 30, and the ticking of your biological clock gets louder and louder, and you realize you can't play these bullshit games anymore, you stop going for the jerks and find the closest nice guy you can find. Wait, I take that back, the absolute worst part is that we let you do it. We've been starved for your attention since puberty, and now we're all too happy to get it. We're nice guys too, so we accept you when you come around, instead of giving you the cold shoulder in return you've been giving us for 15 years. 

I used to be a nice guy. f*** that. I took the phone calls, I dished out the compliments, I listened, I gave so much advice, ****, I should have a doctorate in psychology conferred to me right this instant. I used to be a nice guy, and I figured that I didn't need to actively look for a girl - that if I just got to know people, some girl would get to know me and really like me and develop an interest in me. I thought that I would make for an ideal partner, I'd open up with you, and be there as much or as little as you wanted me to. 

I used to be a nice guy. What did that get me? 21 years of my right hand and softcore porn on Showtime. So, f*** it. f*** it entirely. I'm not going to try to meet women and get to know them, and to hell with the phone calls at one in the morning. Next time you start bitching to me over the fact that he hasn't called in a week, I'm just going to smile at you and say "Ok." In fact, maybe, I'll tell you to call him. Better yet, go over to his house, and drop your pants for him right this moment. Save us all some time. I feel the desire to be that good, dependable, caring friend slipping rapidly away. 

And I like that. 

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Mythrel
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Post by Mythrel » Feb 4th, '06, 15:28

Women generally do look for a nice guy though. I think whoever wrote that artical is bullshit. Sure when women are younger they will usually go for the biggest **** of the group but when they grow up and mature a little they start to see who and what those types of guys are. That artical is completely written from a mans point of view. Now tell me how am I suppose to believe something from a guy who is clearly insenstive? Yet he understands women... I'm thinking no. Nice guys generally finish last because they usually don't make the first move or any move at all. Oh well I guess players will always exist trying to put out their propaganda on how they know a different sex. They will never understand women, they are too focused on themselves.

kotaeshiranaihito
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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 4th, '06, 15:39

Ok, I want to settle this whole "nice guy" thing right now.

Fiction: women are the best source to go for advice because after all, who knows more about a woman than a woman?

Fact: women are THE WORST source for advice about women. 100% of them will lie to you and to themselves about what they really want. The best place for advice about women is from guys who had a lot of experiences with women.

Fiction: girls don't like guys that are nice to them, they only like assholes.

Fact: girls DO like nice guys, BUT they don't like PUSHOVERS. There is a big difference between a nice guy and a pushover, and what azreal described is definitely a pushover.

Fiction: girls are smart, nice and sweet little angels and soon enough they will repay kindness.

Fact: they're greedy, spoiled, and selfish and in the end only care about themselves (and just for the record I'm not dissing females, I believe the same thing about all people. And don't give me that "butzors I lika know dis 1 personz whoz ze nizezt evarz". I knew a woman who was ten times nicer than anyone you probably know. She was nice enough to loan my mom $1000 when she was in need, and told her that she had over a year to pay it off, and a few months later she called demanding all of the money back just because she suddenly decided to take a vacation), and if you lie down in front of them they will step on you, then spit on you, do a tap dance, then come around again and do it again and maybe they'll invite their friends to do it as well.

Fiction: just continue lying on that ground and someday she'll realize what a good person you are, help you up and love will triumph in the end.

Fact: According to Machiavelli (my idol), a prince can have the people love them and/or fear/respect them, and the ideal goal for a prince is to have both, BUT if you can't have both go for the second one. It's the same in relationships. Although it's ideal to have both and that is definitely something you should strive for, first and foremost you must have her respect (you that thing they always BS about how they want it so much), and absolutely no one (no man or woman) can respect a pushover.

I'm sure a lot of people on this board would think of me as one of the assholes, but that is as far from the truth as possible. In fact I am a nice guy. Why? Because I tell people the truth, I give people a dose of the harsh reality. Instead of giving them comfort (which I almost never do because 99% of the people seeking it don't deserve it), I give them a kick in the ass, because I believe that is what most people need to get them moving forward instead of letting them stand in one spot feeling sorry for themselves (esp if they have nothing to feel sorry about). That, at least in my opinion is what a nice guys does. Not all people like me but a lot of them respect what I have to say.

So to all pushovers, here is your kick in the ass. If she starts calling you at 1am in the morning to complain, IGNORE BUTTON ANYONE? If she comes over crying to you about her boyfriend being an ****, DON'T COMFORT HER, not even if he beat her. Tell her the honest truth "you made your bed, now either sleep in it or unmake it". Don't you understand that your pity is THE ONLY thing they want from you? Don't give it to them. They don't deserve it, save your pity for people who have terminal diseases. And don't be afraid to tell them off. If the thing you're scared about is losing their friendship, guess what? If they never respected you, they were never your friends to begin with.

And also, a common thing with nice guys is that they're shy. I know it's hard but try to be a little more impulsive. According to Machiavelli, younger people should be more impulsive while older people should be more prudent. If you see a chance for a kiss, take it (and if you need a few beers to get you to that impulsive state buy them), and don't listen to women's "ask them if you can kiss them" crap.
Last edited by kotaeshiranaihito on Feb 4th, '06, 15:53, edited 1 time in total.

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bugsie
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Post by bugsie » Feb 4th, '06, 15:44

@kotaeshiranaihito: lol, that was a good read. :P

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Post by P0KEY » Feb 4th, '06, 19:01

kotaeshiranaihito wrote:Ok, I want to settle this whole "nice guy" thing right now.

Fiction: women are the best source to go for advice because after all, who knows more about a woman than a woman?

Fact: women are THE WORST source for advice about women. 100% of them will lie to you and to themselves about what they really want. The best place for advice about women is from guys who had a lot of experiences with women.

Fiction: girls don't like guys that are nice to them, they only like assholes.

Fact: girls DO like nice guys, BUT they don't like PUSHOVERS. There is a big difference between a nice guy and a pushover, and what azreal described is definitely a pushover.

Fiction: girls are smart, nice and sweet little angels and soon enough they will repay kindness.

Fact: they're greedy, spoiled, and selfish and in the end only care about themselves (and just for the record I'm not dissing females, I believe the same thing about all people. And don't give me that "butzors I lika know dis 1 personz whoz ze nizezt evarz". I knew a woman who was ten times nicer than anyone you probably know. She was nice enough to loan my mom $1000 when she was in need, and told her that she had over a year to pay it off, and a few months later she called demanding all of the money back just because she suddenly decided to take a vacation), and if you lie down in front of them they will step on you, then spit on you, do a tap dance, then come around again and do it again and maybe they'll invite their friends to do it as well.

Fiction: just continue lying on that ground and someday she'll realize what a good person you are, help you up and love will triumph in the end.

Fact: According to Machiavelli (my idol), a prince can have the people love them and/or fear/respect them, and the ideal goal for a prince is to have both, BUT if you can't have both go for the second one. It's the same in relationships. Although it's ideal to have both and that is definitely something you should strive for, first and foremost you must have her respect (you that thing they always BS about how they want it so much), and absolutely no one (no man or woman) can respect a pushover.

I'm sure a lot of people on this board would think of me as one of the assholes, but that is as far from the truth as possible. In fact I am a nice guy. Why? Because I tell people the truth, I give people a dose of the harsh reality. Instead of giving them comfort (which I almost never do because 99% of the people seeking it don't deserve it), I give them a kick in the ass, because I believe that is what most people need to get them moving forward instead of letting them stand in one spot feeling sorry for themselves (esp if they have nothing to feel sorry about). That, at least in my opinion is what a nice guys does. Not all people like me but a lot of them respect what I have to say.

So to all pushovers, here is your kick in the ass. If she starts calling you at 1am in the morning to complain, IGNORE BUTTON ANYONE? If she comes over crying to you about her boyfriend being an ****, DON'T COMFORT HER, not even if he beat her. Tell her the honest truth "you made your bed, now either sleep in it or unmake it". Don't you understand that your pity is THE ONLY thing they want from you? Don't give it to them. They don't deserve it, save your pity for people who have terminal diseases. And don't be afraid to tell them off. If the thing you're scared about is losing their friendship, guess what? If they never respected you, they were never your friends to begin with.

And also, a common thing with nice guys is that they're shy. I know it's hard but try to be a little more impulsive. According to Machiavelli, younger people should be more impulsive while older people should be more prudent. If you see a chance for a kiss, take it (and if you need a few beers to get you to that impulsive state buy them), and don't listen to women's "ask them if you can kiss them" crap.
being a girl myself, i agree with some aspects of your claim. however, i do not think you have met all the girls in the entire world to make your claim valid. there are always exceptions to the rule, and i'm not saying that i am the exception to the rule, but this advice does not apply to all men; women are all different, and they need to be treated differently. the term "nice" means differently for all women--my definition of nice will definitely not be the same as, say, a 23 year old woman who likes clubbing's definition of "nice". i do agree with your point that women do not like pushovers; i`m sure that men do not like women pushovers either, just like both men and women don't like assholes. you statement about "they're greedy, spoiled, and selfish and in the end only care about themselves" comes from your personal experience, and i understand that you are not dissing women, but from one personal experience you gather a claim that all women are like that. it's like if i met a guy who is a complete jerk, i will think all men are jerks, which is definitely not true. the fiction statement "girls are smart, nice and sweet little angels and soon enough they will repay kindness." is one that i do not agree with, and i do not think anyone agrees with that; as i said before, this all depends on the girl. there is always a bad apple in the bunch. as i girl, even i do not agree with that. what you are stating is very obvious, and does not need to be said. i think everyone knows that women are not all smart, nice, and sweet little angels. next, "just continue lying on that ground and someday she'll realize what a good person you are, help you up and love will triumph in the end." does not work for anyone for that matter; if a girl lays around and thinking that a guy will realize how nice she is and blahblahblah, i doubt that the guy will come either. it's very common sense. again, very obvious, and i believe everyone understands that aspect. then you go on to elevate yourself with "Why? Because I tell people the truth, I give people a dose of the harsh reality. Instead of giving them comfort (which I almost never do because 99% of the people seeking it don't deserve it), I give them a kick in the ass, because I believe that is what most people need to get them moving forward instead of letting them stand in one spot feeling sorry for themselves (esp if they have nothing to feel sorry about). That, at least in my opinion is what a nice guys does. Not all people like me but a lot of them respect what I have to say." how exactly do you know that you are completely right? how do you know what is the harsh truth? from personal experience? i believe personal experience contributes a factor in your decisions, but to infect others with your personal experiences that affect their decisions saying that your claim is "the harsh truth" is wrong, because their experiences differ from yours. so if you actually meet a girl who goes against the standard of your fiction statements, then what do you do? and when a girl calls you up at 1am to complain, i mean, if anyone calls me up at 1am to complain, i would ignore it anyways, and as a normal human being, i would be a annoyed. i do agree most nice guys get pushed around a lot, but that does not make all girls what you say they are. and since you are the "nice guy" you claim you are, do you have a girlfriend? and if you do, did you follow any of the rules that you claim? and i do not know why you have this grudge against women, and if you say that you do not, i get a negative connotation from your post, although i agree with some aspects of it. i believe that these days, women have a bad reputation in the eyes of men because men meet the bitchiest girls, whereas the better ones do not speak out that much. i believe men can also be jerks, and what you're trying to say is very one sided and biased.

ack! i`ve talked too much! kotaeshiranaihito, i`m not trying to bash you or argue with you, i just see some imperfections in your claim. you have your definition of nice guy, and i have mine :-) ganbatte!

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Post by Mythrel » Feb 4th, '06, 19:13

XD Nice post P0KEY

kotaeshiranaihito, I just don't think we can agree or see eye to eye.. I agree with some of your fact/fiction stuff, but it isn't anything new. The last 3 paragraphs though kinda shocked me and I don't really want to start any bad blood so I will keep my opinions to myself.

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 4th, '06, 19:49

@pokey

I don't mean to offend you by saying this, but please use paragraphs, that thing was a real eye sore to read.

Anyway, I don't hold any grudge against anyone. Was that post one sided? Yes. Why? Because it was a rebuttal to the article that was written above it. If you want me to rebuttal an article about men and the types of women they choose for themselves, by all means post it and I will give my rebuttal.

But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?

The "greedy, selfish" thing was a line from Machiavelli (should've mentioned that) and once again this was not against women, but as Machiavelli wrote, people in general. I truly believe that in the end people only care about themselves and a small circle of others around them, utilitarianism is a myth IMO.

(end of rebuttal to pokey, the rest is just general and not directed at anyone, sorry for the mistake)

Believe me when I say this, I do not hold any sort of grudges against any group of people. I am simply stating what I see in the real world, some of it is based off of scientific studies, others off of many experiences that I see people face everyday, and yes not all of it will be all nice and sugar coated. That is not reality. I don't tell people what they want to hear, I tell them what I believe they need to hear. If the emperor looks naked then he is naked and no amount of pretty words can cover him up.

I never claimed to be a genius, and I never said one rule applies to everyone. If you truly believe I am wrong, then by all means rebuttal me. I don't mind being proved wrong.

Just 2 things.

1) please use paragraphs :-)

2) don't rebuttal with things like: "you're wrong and I'm right because I said so", "you're wrong because I know this one person who is exactly the opposite of what you say", or even worst rebuttal with cliches like "people just haven't found the one person that was meant for them" or "just wait until you experience true love which is like floating on cloud nine and being brought to bliss by the kisses from a thousand angels etc etc etc".

Nobody is 100% correct (me included), anomalies will always exist. If you can give me some hard evidence to prove your point, I will accept it and try to rebuttal it if I can. That's the difference between a discussion and a flame war.

Which reminds me, please no personal attacks. Those do not lead the discussion anywhere.
Last edited by kotaeshiranaihito on Feb 4th, '06, 22:53, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Xi@h » Feb 4th, '06, 19:57

:w000t:

Pokey => :thumright: Well said

Mythrel => :thumleft: hmm... you always have no-weak statements!! Aren't you a born philosopher aniki?

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Post by Mythrel » Feb 4th, '06, 20:20

LOL I like how you claim her reply isn't a well done rebuttle, but your arguement was anything but strong. Infact your first post was mostly about the obvious then at the bottom 3 paragraphs you posted your philosophy on the subject. Now you reply attacking her points with no real points behind them. I am not seeing where this is going to be honest.

LOL thanks Jeremiah, but I am trying to stay out of the debate :X Bad mood posting doesn't make the best reply :X

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Post by bugsie » Feb 4th, '06, 20:23

P0KEY wrote: ack! i`ve talked too much! kotaeshiranaihito, i`m not trying to bash you or argue with you, i just see some imperfections in your claim. you have your definition of nice guy, and i have mine :-) ganbatte!
i was reading kotaeshiranaihito's post and i agree with you guys, there were few things that i don't agree in. but after reading what you just said and saw this statement, i realized that you are still confused in many things in dealing with people. and yes, i am off topic. :offtopic:

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Post by P0KEY » Feb 4th, '06, 20:33

kotaeshiranaihito wrote:@pokey

I don't mean to offend you by saying this, but please use paragraphs, that thing was a real eye sore to read.

Anyway, I don't hold any grudge against anyone. Was that post one sided? Yes. Why? Because it was a rebuttle to the article that was written above it. If you want me to rebuttle an article about men and the types of women they choose for themselves, by all means post it and I will give my rebuttle.

But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?

The "greedy, selfish" thing was a line from machiavelli (should've mentioned that) and once again this was not against women, but as machiavelli wrote, people in general. I truly believe that in the end people only care about themselves and a small circle of others around them, utalitarianism is a myth IMO.

Believe me when I say this, I do not hold any sort of grudges against any group of people. I am simply stating what I see in the real world, some of it is based off of scientific studies, others off of many experiences that I see people face everyday, and yes not all of it will be all nice and sugar coated. That is not reality. I don't tell people what they want to hear, I tell them what I believe they need to hear. If the emperor looks naked then he is naked and no amount of pretty words can cover him up.

I never claimed to be a genius, and I never said one rule applies to everyone. If you truly believe I am wrong, then by all means rebuttle me. I don't mind being proved wrong.

Just 2 things.

1) please use paragraphs :-)

2) don't rebuttle with things like: "you're wrong and I'm right because I said so", "you're wrong because I know this one person who is exactly the opposite of what you say", or even worst rebuttle with cliches like "people just haven't found the one person that was meant for them" or "just wait until you experience true love which is like floating on cloud nine and being brought to bliss by the kisses from a thousand angels etc etc etc".

Nobody is 100% correct (me included), anomalies will always exist. If you can give me some hard evidence to prove your point, I will accept it and try to rebuttle it if I can. That's the difference between a discussion and a flame war.
ok, i want you to understand something. (hey look i`m using paragraphs :lol )

"2) don't rebuttle with things like: "you're wrong and I'm right because I said so", "you're wrong because I know this one person who is exactly the opposite of what you say", or even worst rebuttle with cliches like "people just haven't found the one person that was meant for them" or "just wait until you experience true love which is like floating on cloud nine and being brought to bliss by the kisses from a thousand angels etc etc etc"."
----- err... come again? sorry, but this was confusing. i don`t think i claimed that "i`m right because i say so and you`re wrong". it was more like "i think this statement is wrong because...". and i did not say that i knew anyone exactly opposite of what you said. i said "what if you meet someone that goes against the grain of your standards, then what would you do?". please read carefully before attacking that side of the argument. and cliche`s? :blink i don`t think i stated any cliches in my rebuttle; i am smart enough to know those are not valid claims. i simply stated that people are not all the same, and have different viewpoints on one subject, or matter. and did not by any means say that you are wrong because i said so. i feel like you`re trying to make me look like i`m bossy and controlling, which i do not think i am. and if you are to support your rebuttle, please give me some examples from my reply to validate your claim. in my reply to your previous post, i quoted from your post for reference so people can see where i am coming from, because this post kind of confused me.

(hey another paragraph!) :salut:

"But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?"
---- i did not attack any one side, i was pointing out the other side of the problem (or i should say concept, its not exactly a problem lol ^^)

as for your "DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly", how do you know that i did not think that? don`t you think this also applies to nice girls? what about men that take advantage of girls that are nice, doesn`t it apply to both parties in question? again, you state the obvious. and you have already stated that nice guys get pushed around even when they are not push-overs--that was the main point of your first post anyways, so i did not feel the need to address it. again, please read carefully.

(ahhhhhhhh another paragraph :whistling: )

"The "greedy, selfish" thing was a line from machiavelli (should've mentioned that) and once again this was not against women, but as machiavelli wrote, people in general. I truly believe that in the end people only care about themselves and a small circle of others around them, utalitarianism is a myth IMO."
-- this is fine by me, i am a huge advocate of looking up to a role model or idol. but you really should have mentioned it was from machiavelli, because then it confused me once again. 8)

(paragraph paragraph paragraph paragraph)

"Believe me when I say this, I do not hold any sort of grudges against any group of people. I am simply stating what I see in the real world, some of it is based off of scientific studies, others off of many experiences that I see people face everyday, and yes not all of it will be all nice and sugar coated. That is not reality. I don't tell people what they want to hear, I tell them what I believe they need to hear. If the emperor looks naked then he is naked and no amount of pretty words can cover him up."
-- erm. scientific studies? what does that have to do with women and nice men? i mean, statistics probably are more believable, but what does scientific studies have to do with it? in your first post, you mentioned nothing of scientific studies. please know what you are talking about, i`m specialize in science, and scientific studies consists of the scientific method, ecology, evolution, etc. unless you are talking about psychology, but that still does not relate to your point.

(gimme a p! gimme an a! gimme a r! gimme an a! gimme a g! gimme a r! gimme an a! gimme a p! gimme a h! WOOO paragraph!!)

"I don't tell people what they want to hear, I tell them what I believe they need to hear"
-- how do you know what they need to hear? you tell them what you "believe" they need to hear, which is not necesarrily what they need to hear. and what if they don`t want to hear what you say? ahh thats another story ^____^y

(hpargarap is paragraph spelled backwards!!)


"Nobody is 100% correct (me included), anomalies will always exist. If you can give me some hard evidence to prove your point"
-- seriously, dude, i would like to see YOU gimme some cold hard evidence first so i actually have something to rebuttle UPON :crazy:

" That's the difference between a discussion and a flame war"
-- i certainly don`t want this to become a flame war!

whew this took way too long :roll :goggle: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :lol :lol :lol :lol :D

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Post by Calcifer » Feb 4th, '06, 20:54

I wonder why most threads I see are about how to "make" girls like a guy and why there aren't all too many that are the other way around...

No amount of "making" or "guiding" will help any guy if you have the personality of a disease or don't take care of your health. Other than that, it's going to depend on how well your personality matches that of people you meet.

I agree with respect being important. If you don't have some degree of mutual respect, there's only going to be trouble.

Being honest and being harshly blunt are two different things. There's a reason stores will lose customers if they don't know the meaning of tact. People will always need comfort and truth (comfort is not pity). The trick is not to give only one or the other, but a good mix of both. Telling only what "people need to hear" without any humanity will make you look condescending and you can forget about people ever coming to you for anything ever again.

Being nice is never a bad thing; I don't think I'm wrong to say that 9 out of 10 girls will prefer a kind person to a cool-looking **** in real life. Bad boys are hot and sexy, yes, but only on tv series.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 4th, '06, 21:08

something in kotaeshiranaihito's post makes me think he doesn't believe in men and women being friends... just friends, nothing else.... which against a lot of opinions i think is a total crock... if a guy however only pretends to be a friend in order to maybe one day fill the spot of that "special person" in that particular girl's life, his bad entirely...

i have thankfully never been in a position where i had to call a friend of any gender at one in the morning because my boyfriend beat me... but the fact that kotaeshiranaihito advises men to tell that girl to deal with it or change her situation instead of comforting her, well yeah, that's definitely an **** thing to say in my book... people make stupid mistakes all the time, but if you are a true friend to them, you help them through no matter what...

i've heard and told my share of avoidable stupid relationship trouble, key here is usually to not give advice if you are unable to deal with it not being heeded... fact is, the people that seek advice are still the ones making the decisions, they tend to sift through what you tell them and apply only those things they feel are right for them... and it just so happens you are not in any position ever to make that choice for them...

in any case, for starters, figure out if you want to be a friend to her or her lover and then refrain from idling in the friend status if this is not a position you are aiming for...
i'm not saying that good friends can't become lovers, but i don't think it's a good idea to become a friend with ulterior motives to begin with...

i would agree that most women probably don't like pushovers as lovers, it just shifts that power aspect into a ratio most women aren't comfortable with... primal urges somewhere still call for a male protector and a pushover hardly portrays that image effectively... but i know very few women who would pass on someone they find is attractive to them, can take care of himself and happens to have nice guy qualities...

but this is where i think a lot of preconceived notions come in... just because you're a nice guy, doesn't necessarily mean the woman of your choice will fall in love with you...
if there just isn't any attraction, you can be as nice as you want, but being her friend is probably the most you could hope for...

of course this still leaves that notion in general that women simply aren't attracted to nice guys.... well... it's entirely possible that women aren't attracted to a more homely looking nice guy rather than a handsome ****... but i'm wondering if the homely looking nice guy's object of affection is a real ugly duckling herself... regarding that situation though, i'd say she's better off with neither... :lol
yes, a lot of women want the whole package and this often leaves them in heartbreak land, because such complete fantasy packages are rare and the competition for them fierce... :lol

and the whole thing about looks shouldn't matter is just another fantasy... because they do... but it's also not true that every man a woman goes out with has to be drop dead gorgeous to everyone, but he does have to be that for her...i've been with men others found attractive, i've been with men only i found attractive... essentially it would be his whole individual package that attracted me... i don't consider myself to be a drop dead gorgeous woman and there are just some men i would never assume to have a chance with, whether i try for them anyway or not is handled on a case by case basis...

to wrap things up, it's a misconception that nice guys don't stand a chance against assholes where women are concerned... it's often true though that good looking guys get the girl quicker, whether they keep them or not is another matter...

my advice would be to just be yourself, no false pretenses, either they like you or they don't... and come equipped to handle either outcome... take it or leave it... :wink:

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 4th, '06, 23:35

Just to correct that mistake those last few paragraphs weren't directed at you, but were just put for general reference because I've had other rebuttals that were just like that where some people just said "I don't believe in science and I'm right, you're wrong", they threw out some cliches and starting attacking me personally (I'm not going to say any names though). I edited it and placed a marker in parenthesis to separate my rebuttal to you and my general message.
P0KEY wrote:
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:@pokey

"But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?"
---- i did not attack any one side, i was pointing out the other side of the problem (or i should say concept, its not exactly a problem lol ^^)

as for your "DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly", how do you know that i did not think that? don`t you think this also applies to nice girls? what about men that take advantage of girls that are nice, doesn`t it apply to both parties in question? again, you state the obvious. and you have already stated that nice guys get pushed around even when they are not push-overs--that was the main point of your first post anyways, so i did not feel the need to address it. again, please read carefully.
And I did not attack any side either, I was pointing out the other side of your rebuttal to me.

And your point about nice girls has nothing to do with the discussion. I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. The article was not about nice girls. If you want to start a discussion on nice girls and how they are treated you may start a new thread and we could talk about it there.

And no I never stated that nice guys get pushed around even if they are not push overs. Once again I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. Out of curiosity did you read it? If you did you would see that in my rebuttal I was siding WITH girls who refuse to date "nice guys" as he claimed.

@mythrel, just because they were obvious to you doesn't mean they were obvious to other people. You don't like my philosophy? Great. I don't like your philosophies either. And you know for someone who is always acting so optimistic about relationships and such, you sure are in a bad mood a lot.

@ ironwave

I agree with everything you said about looks. In fact I actually made a rant about it in a different threat. (@pokey: And that was where I talked about scientific and psychological studies on looks and how they affect society as a whole, and that was where I got the useless rebuttals).

Now to defend what I said about not comforting people who made mistakes. People make mistakes, usually they're stupid mistakes that can easily be avoided. You believe that these people deserve comfort, I don't.

There are two reasons why I believe this.

1) If you comfort them, that's equivalent to babying them, and by doing so you aren't letting them learn a real lesson from their mistake. The human body has pain receptors for the purpose of teaching the brain that by doing a particular thing you are endangering the body, and I believe emotional pain is exactly the same thing. But because emotional pain (as well as physical pain that deals with emotional disputes) is not the same as regular physical pain, as in it involves a lot of other factors, I believe that it is best to not comfort and let them experience the full package. Then and only then will they realize that they were truly mistaken and hopefully they will not do it again.

2) Sometimes when people come seeking comfort, all they really want is validation that they are nothing more than innocent victims and that they did nothing wrong. If they receive that comfort, they will truly believe that they were right in all their moves, that the other person was 100% wrong and they did nothing to deserve what they are getting. Once again, they will not learn anything and they will continue to make the same mistakes over and over.

You may think I'm an ****, but all I'm trying to do is let people learn and grow so they don't have to experience the pain they feel now again in the future. If that makes me an **** in your book, then so be it. You have your ways of handling people in pain, I have mine. I'm sure that in some cases your way is better and in some cases mine is. And calling me an **** for simply believing something you don't is a personal attack BTW. You don't see me calling you a soft hearted hippie for your statement do you?

And your assumption about me thinking guys and girls never being friends is wrong. In fact I personally have many female friends (in real life and on the Internet), I gave them the exact advice I am giving here and they all said I was right and thanked me, and came back to me for more. I guess since this is just a message board it all depends on how we perceive what we read. I perceive this stuff as realistic, while I'm sure you and others perceive it as vindictive. In real life our words would probably sound a lot different (since a lot of communication is non verbal after all).

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 4th, '06, 23:51

i said it was an **** thing to say, not that you are in fact an ****, only you and the people who know you could make that determination...
if you aren't one to comfort people in pain, that just makes you not my kind of person...
and there's a world of difference between comforting and babying or justifying their positions... but i'm certainly not gonna tell a woman who's just been beaten "hey, you asked for it" or in your words "you've made your bed, now lie in it"...
:lol that's some coldhearted **** any way you look at it...
and you don't really have to parade your advice giving successes for my benefit, the theory on you not believing in male-female friendships was merely thrown out there because you gave this scenario of the nice guy being the poor dummy who gets all her woes dumped on him without benefits... he shouldn't be vying for her attentions under the guise of friendship to begin with... and like i said before, a true friend without ulterior motives doesn't need that kind of advice... he'll offer comfort to someone hurt and hopefully have enough tact to save his lectures for a later date...

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 5th, '06, 00:01

Well for your information I had a friend who was beaten by her boyfriend. I didn't comfort her, but her best friend did, even though I warned her not to.

Her boyfriend got out of jail and she went back to him and ended up breaking ties with her best friend and me because we didn't want her to go back to him.

And this is not an anomaly, this kind of thing happens all the time.

And you I am guessing did not thoroughly read my post, nor did you read azreal's article otherwise you wouldn't suggest that I was saying that the "nice guy" was a dummy with ulterior motives (or whatever you said it was). Since I was pretty much saying the opposite and once again I was SIDING WITH THE GIRLS WHO CHOSE NOT TO DATE "NICE GUYS". I never made attacks at women directly, I wrote that I believe the same thing for all people, just because I choose to bring women down to the level of us mere humans, and not raise them to some pedestal, doesn't mean I was attacking them.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 5th, '06, 01:06

kotaeshiranaihito wrote:Well for your information...
lol, now don't get your panties all in a wad... :lol
i never said good advice shouldn't be given, just that it isn't up to you whether or not she heeds it... deal with it....
i'm also not portraying you as anyone against or bashing females, i just don't agree with your "comforting or lack thereof" habits...
so you had a "female friend being banged up" incident and both you and your other friend were "dismissed" for not agreeing on her views... so what? you're glad you saved yourself the trouble of comforting her? effectively it made no difference either way? you think without comfort things would've turned out differently? here's a newsflash... you'll never know either way, you just weren't there for a friend in need... more power to you man, whatever works for you i guess...
i don't feel the need as a female to be hoisted on a pedestal, so i don't mind you levelling the playing field... i simply also don't agree with your conceptions about all humans in general...
and the assumption i didn't read azrAEl's message would be incorrect, my error however stems from reading it and yours and confusing the "nice guy - ulterior motive" concept between the both of you... my apologies on that...
here's a fact for you too... you could take a bit of your own advice and read the posts carefully as well before admonishing others in such a... what's the word i'm looking for... ah, yes, bitchy manner... :lol
because you are evidently also laboring under a few misconceptions hopefully alleviated herewith... because being of the female gender does not make me automatically stamp you a woman hater... hence, the defensive stance on that issue is unnecessary... feel free to rebut(tal) :lol this...
ok, now i'm being bad... lol :whistling:

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Post by wingsky » Feb 5th, '06, 01:09

Ahhh so many long posts dun think i can read it all being a lazy slob :lol

make girls like you? be funny! that will always work, to get them to love you? now thats a different and more difficult story... :scratch: :P

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 5th, '06, 02:49

I didn't assume that you thought I was a man hater simply because you're a woman. I assumed it because you accused both me and azrael of trying to befriend girls with an ulterior motive.

In my opinion your automatic belief (which btw is a very common answer from women on that subject) nice guys aren't really nice, because they only befriend girls with an ulterior motive is first of all only reading what you want to read, second your own defensive response that you accused me of saying, and third enough of a reason to assume you think I'm a woman hater-at least for me anyway.

Anyway you said that wasn't the case, so I guess we were both a little too defensive in our posts. I personally believe that azrael did not become friends with a lot of different girls with ulterior motives in his head but was more mad at the fact that things like this happen. And furthermore since when is having a crush on your friend a bad thing? Just because she doesn't have the same feelings for him? If a girl had a crush on her male friend, and she tried to be near him to get closer, would you say she's in the wrong because she has "ulterior motives" as you phrased it? I personally don't think so and it happened to me before (the female friend having a crush on me while I had a girlfriend thing).

As for your response to my battered friend story, just trust me, you're wrong. I wouldn't just put it up if I wasn't sure that the comforting was a big factor in her going back to him. I don't want to post the whole story on a public board, but if you really want to know what happened I can PM the story to you, providing you promise not to post it.

Anyway we were both wrong to some extent, and we both assumed too much from the little information we received. We both still have our opinions and neither of us truly know which one is best. Mine worked for me and I'm sure yours worked for you.

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Post by Mythrel » Feb 5th, '06, 04:59

kotaeshiranaihito wrote: @mythrel, just because they were obvious to you doesn't mean they were obvious to other people. You don't like my philosophy? Great. I don't like your philosophies either. And you know for someone who is always acting so optimistic about relationships and such, you sure are in a bad mood a lot.


I forgot I'm human. Welcome to being a human 101, or did you miss that class? Being in a bad mood like 2 times and they happened to be around the time you post and suddenly im the one in the bad mood. You are pretty good at making assumptions.......

Edit: I'm glad you don't like my philosophies or I would have to consider changing them...
Last edited by Mythrel on Feb 5th, '06, 18:01, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 5th, '06, 10:43

maybe i have to pick this apart for you a bit so you understand better...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:I didn't assume that you thought I was a man hater simply because you're a woman. I assumed it because you accused both me and azrael of trying to befriend girls with an ulterior motive.
1 - i never accused you of being a man-hater or anything else for that matter

2 - azrael's diatribe obviously stems from his own frustrations in taking the "friend" position while expecting her to look at how nice he is and choose him, which evidently never happened, hence this:

"I used to be a nice guy. What did that get me? 21 years of my right hand and softcore porn on Showtime. So, f*** it. f*** it entirely. I'm not going to try to meet women and get to know them, and to hell with the phone calls at one in the morning. Next time you start bitching to me over the fact that he hasn't called in a week, I'm just going to smile at you and say "Ok." In fact, maybe, I'll tell you to call him. Better yet, go over to his house, and drop your pants for him right this moment. Save us all some time. I feel the desire to be that good, dependable, caring friend slipping rapidly away."

and i've already established the fact that i mistook both your positions and apologized for this mistake...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:In my opinion your automatic belief (which btw is a very common answer from women on that subject) nice guys aren't really nice, because they only befriend girls with an ulterior motive is first of all only reading what you want to read, second your own defensive response that you accused me of saying, and third enough of a reason to assume you think I'm a woman hater-at least for me anyway.
Anyway you said that wasn't the case, so I guess we were both a little too defensive in our posts.
3 - i don't have an automatic belief like that and i don't make generalized blanket statements like this, following is what i really said and it was fitted precisely to the scenario azrael gave, nothing else:

" if a guy however only pretends to be a friend in order to maybe one day fill the spot of that "special person" in that particular girl's life, his bad entirely... "

notice the IF A GUY... and that should also clear up that it wasn't a defensive response, but a statement of opinion regarding the same scenario, which essentially negates your reason to assume i think you're a woman-hater.... and being defensive is far removed from correcting misconceptions... so i'm not sure where you got the impression of a defensive stance on my part...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:I personally believe that azrael did not become friends with a lot of different girls with ulterior motives in his head but was more mad at the fact that things like this happen. And furthermore since when is having a crush on your friend a bad thing? Just because she doesn't have the same feelings for him? If a girl had a crush on her male friend, and she tried to be near him to get closer, would you say she's in the wrong because she has "ulterior motives" as you phrased it? I personally don't think so and it happened to me before (the female friend having a crush on me while I had a girlfriend thing).
4 - whether azrael did or didn't become friends with lots of different girls under ulterior motives is beside the point... the passage i quoted for you above is something i based a solitary opinion on that the "covert friendship operation" hardly allows for feelings of disappointment, effectively, he made his own bed, don't ya think?

5 - i didn't say having a crush on a friend is a bad thing, here's what i said on that:

"i'm not saying that good friends can't become lovers, but i don't think it's a good idea to become a friend with ulterior motives to begin with..."

and she wouldn't be wrong to try and get close that way, but she would be wrong to blame her disappointments when not achieving her goal on HIM... as azrael obviously blamed his on HER... i simply said it's not a good idea, especially if the outcome isn't what he/she expects...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:As for your response to my battered friend story, just trust me, you're wrong. I wouldn't just put it up if I wasn't sure that the comforting was a big factor in her going back to him. I don't want to post the whole story on a public board, but if you really want to know what happened I can PM the story to you, providing you promise not to post it.
6 - concerning this it would show that bringing in bit parts about personal experiences to back up arguments isn't a good idea either... the other party of the argument cannot have full information and therefore cannot be blamed for opinions based only on the information given... it's easy to come around later and say "trust me, you're wrong about this" because obviously your "facts" cannot be verified... and another thing about personal experiences like that is that they are usually a solitary event, which also hardly allows assumptions on situations like that in general...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:Anyway we were both wrong to some extent, and we both assumed too much from the little information we received. We both still have our opinions and neither of us truly know which one is best. Mine worked for me and I'm sure yours worked for you.
7 - what you are correct about is that we both have our opinions and neither can truly know which is best, primarily because every situation tends to call for unique handling... which is just another point in fact that blanket statements and opinions should be avoided like the plague...

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Post by P0KEY » Feb 5th, '06, 18:28

*claps for ironicwave*
i see i`m not the only one here having a debate with this guy; but when everyone seems to disagree with the guy, doesn`t that show something to that guy? this guy just doesn`t get it.... :-)

now my turn!!
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:Just to correct that mistake those last few paragraphs weren't directed at you, but were just put for general reference because I've had other rebuttals that were just like that where some people just said "I don't believe in science and I'm right, you're wrong", they threw out some cliches and starting attacking me personally (I'm not going to say any names though). I edited it and placed a marker in parenthesis to separate my rebuttal to you and my general message.
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:@pokey

"But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?"
---- i did not attack any one side, i was pointing out the other side of the problem (or i should say concept, its not exactly a problem lol ^^)

as for your "DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly", how do you know that i did not think that? don`t you think this also applies to nice girls? what about men that take advantage of girls that are nice, doesn`t it apply to both parties in question? again, you state the obvious. and you have already stated that nice guys get pushed around even when they are not push-overs--that was the main point of your first post anyways, so i did not feel the need to address it. again, please read carefully.
And I did not attack any side either, I was pointing out the other side of your rebuttal to me.

And your point about nice girls has nothing to do with the discussion. I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. The article was not about nice girls. If you want to start a discussion on nice girls and how they are treated you may start a new thread and we could talk about it there.

And no I never stated that nice guys get pushed around even if they are not push overs. Once again I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. Out of curiosity did you read it? If you did you would see that in my rebuttal I was siding WITH girls who refuse to date "nice guys" as he claimed.

@ ironwave

I agree with everything you said about looks. In fact I actually made a rant about it in a different threat. (@pokey: And that was where I talked about scientific and psychological studies on looks and how they affect society as a whole, and that was where I got the useless rebuttals).
Hello once again! I would like to clear some things up here…
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:“because I've had other rebuttals that were just like that where some people just said "I don't believe in science and I'm right, you're wrong", they threw out some cliches and starting attacking me personally”
-- if you were not directing your paragraph at me, then why did you want ME to understand “two things” (the paragraphs thing then your cliche things)? first you make your statement, then you change it? c`mon, man… don`t accuse me of things i didn`t say, and don`t try to squiggle away from your own mistakes :glare:...
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:"And I did not attack any side either, I was pointing out the other side of your rebuttal to me. "
-- did i even mention the word "attack" and "you" in the same sentence? i did not say anything about you attacking any side for that matter. Do not make automatic assumptions from what you think I meant. And isn`t the other side of my rebuttal YOUR argument in the first place? So you were pointing out what you were saying in the first place, and you have no argument there. Very weak.
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:”And your point about nice girls has nothing to do with the discussion. I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. The article was not about nice girls. If you want to start a discussion on nice girls and how they are treated you may start a new thread and we could talk about it there.”
--why does nice girls have nothing to do with the discussion? I thought the point of the discussion was to say that girls are not nice, because men get “treated badly” when they are nice. And even if the nice girls point has nothing to do with the discussion, I did not mention anything that has to do with nice girls. I`m questioning your theory of “not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly” because it applies to both parties—both nice women and nice men get treated badly. everyone has bad experiences of being treated badly. And if you were making a rebuttal to azreal’s article, then why did you direct it at ME? (and don`t try to squiggle out of this one, your whole post at first was a rebuttal to me because you wanted ME to understand two things that weren`t even directed at me in the first place? I think you saw the flaw in your argument and sought a way out, so you just directed it at azreal’s article. Next time clarify who your rebuttal is for.)
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:”And no I never stated that nice guys get pushed around even if they are not push overs. Once again I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. Out of curiosity did you read it? If you did you would see that in my rebuttal I was siding WITH girls who refuse to date "nice guys" as he claimed.”
--so getting “treated badly” does not count for being “pushed around”? so then what does being pushed around count for? That is a very weak argument, try to find something else. And ONCE AGAIN may I remind you that your rebuttal in the previous post was to none other than me because you said clearly that the beginning was a rebuttal to ME from your statement “(end of rebuttal to pokey, the rest is just general and not directed at anyone, sorry for the mistake)” because your “But you know something, your post was a little one sided as well. In the beginning when I was attacking the "nice guys" you immediately agreed with me and DIDN'T EVEN THINK to say something like "well not all nice guys are pushovers and they still get treated badly" or something of the sort. But when I mentioned something against women you immediately start with "not all people are like this and that" speech. That's a little one sided don't you think?” statement indeed came BEFORE the statement about the end of rebuttal to me. Read your own post before posting.
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:“And no I never stated that nice guys get pushed around even if they are not push overs”
--I never stated that nice guys get pushed around if they’re not push-overs either. but I thought you didn`t say that “nice guys get pushed around” but now you`re saying it? You said that “treating badly” doesn`t have anything to do with being “pushed around”. You just contradicted yourself
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:“Once again I was making a rebuttal to azreal's article. Out of curiosity did you read it? If you did you would see that in my rebuttal I was siding WITH girls who refuse to date "nice guys" as he claimed”
--I think your argument was anything but siding with girls who refuse to date “nice guys”. I don`t believe that it was siding with women at all, because women in your opinion are not obviously what other people think they are; hence the “fiction-fact” thing. And btw, the “did you read it” thing doesn`t work for you—I wasn`t even addressing that guy`s article in the first place whereas you were addressing my post earlier, which you didn`t seem to read correctly. Know what you`re talking about before you talk.
kotaeshiranaihito wrote:“(@pokey: And that was where I talked about scientific and psychological studies on looks and how they affect society as a whole, and that was where I got the useless rebuttals).”
--you did NOT talk about scientific and psychological studies; in fact, you didn`t even mention the word “psychology” in your post. i was the one who included the word “psychology” in my post. And what does science have to do with nice men? Looks do not affect how a nice guy functions, it’s irrelevant. And i`m sorry, but you seem to admit yourself that you had “useless rebuttals”. You just TOTALLY contradicted yourself there, I won`t even bother explaining. (unless you meant it as a sarcastic remark, in which I will just ignore).

And another thing:

Your idol, Niccolò Machiavelli wrote the book The Prince, and The Prince is an intensely practical guide to the exercise of raw political power over a Renaissance principality. Allowing for the unpredictable influence of fortune, Machiavelli argued that it is primarily the character or vitality or skill of the individual leader that determines the success of any state. The book surveys various bold means of acquiring and maintaining the principality and evaluates each of them solely by reference to its likelihood of augmenting the glory of the prince while serving the public interest. It is this focus on practical success by any means, even at the expense of traditional moral values, that earned Machiavelli's scheme a reputation for ruthlessness, deception, and cruelty. So he basically became an advocate for governing using violence. In The Prince, Machiavelli offered a monarchical ruler advice designed to keep that ruler in power. He recommended policies that would discourage mass political activism, and channel subjects' energies into private pursuits. Machiavelli wanted to persuade the monarch that he could best preserve his power by the judicious use of violence, by respecting private property and the traditions of his subjects, and by promoting material prosperity. Machiavelli held that political life cannot be governed by a single set of moral or religious absolutes, and that the monarch may sometimes be excused for performing acts of violence and deception that would be ethically indefensible in private life.

His Dell'arte della guerra (The Art of War) (1520) explains in detail effective procedures for the acquisition, maintenance, and use of a military force. Even in his more leisurely reflections on the political process, Machiavelli often wrote in a similar vein. The Discorsi sopra la prima Deca di Tito Livio (Discourses on Livy) (1531) review the history of the Roman republic, with greater emphasis on the role of fortune and a clear admiration for republican government. Here, too, however, Machiavelli's conception of the proper application of morality to practical political life is one that judges the skill of all participants in terms of the efficacy with which they achieve noble ends. Whatever the form of government, Machiavelli held, only success and glory really matter.

People say that Machiavelli is the opposite of the enlightment and renaissance, and although I respect that he is your idol, many people think of him as a corrupt politician, and I believe that because he is your idol, you get your theory of “you made your bed” toward girls. Although I do admit that partly because Machiavelli's pragmatic view of the relationship between ethics and politics, he has been widely misinterpreted. The adjective "Machiavellian" has become a pejorative used to describe a politician who manipulates others in an opportunistic and deceptive way. But even still, when you think of “Hitler”, what does that imply? So when you think Machiavelli, you think a manipulative politician, and when you think Hitler, you think racist politician. Hitler, in some ways, may be misinterpreted too (like he was an artist and vegetarian, and probably a good person at first, but then turned into the racist man he was). No offense to you, but your idol seems to be flawed, and basing your ideas (especially the idea of love) off of this guy seems flawed.

p.s. I guess the rest of my rebuttal wasn`t good enough for you to reply to; or was it so good that you had no rebuttal in the first place? And everywhere you post, you seem to be disagreed with the other people posting. Doesn`t that tell you something about your ideas? If it were one or two people I understand, but from what I read its more than that. Maybe you are just stubborn, and think your personal experiences are everyone else`s experiences, so therefore you “tell them the harsh reality” of it all, when it is in fact, your own reality.

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 5th, '06, 20:49

@pokey

Do you even know what you're arguing about anymore? That entire post looks like nothing more than some garbage you threw together when you were extremely angry.

I suggest getting nice and calm. Read azrael's article (because from reading that last thing it is completely obvious that you didn't), read what I had to write about it, read the any discussion I had with anyone else here, and then make another post that actually makes sense.

If you truly believe that that thing above does make sense however, then I will rebut it just to make you happy. Just say the word.

The one thing I will rebut here is what you said about Machiavelli.

First off I'd like to thank you for telling me all those things about Machiavelli, he was my idol all this time and yet I never really knew anything about him, I always thought he was a rock star </sarcasm>.

1) you're 16, the only real world you know is the one on MTV. Machiavelli spent his entire life studying principalities, ethics, war, and politics. Just because that website you copied and pasted those paragraphs from say that some believe his views are immoral does not mean anything. I never claimed he was moral, I never claimed to be moral either, and I promise you, nobody on this planet is truly moral. The point is he understands people. He knows how to get people on your side, and keep them there. How can you, who never lived in the real world or even read any of his books criticize him? Today, many successful politicians and businessmen/businesswomen refer to his book as their bible. You still need to learn how to read everything a person wrote, and not just what you wanted to read, you're in no position to be criticizing anyone.

2) Comparing a man whose book helped one person to become one of the most loved rulers in Italy to hitler is just ridiculous. Hitler wanted to kill everyone who wasn't of a certain race, neither Machiavelli nor the ruler that he sent to book to ever wanted such a thing. You seem to have a problem with criticizing things you don't read.

3) For those people on the website and those that believe he was immoral, here is a small line from "The Prince" to rebut them
Machiavelli wrote: "for many have pictured republics and principalities which in fact have never been known or seen, because how one lives is so far distant from how one ought to live, that he who neglects what is done for what ought to be done, sooner effects his ruin than his preservation; for a man who wishes to act entirely up to his professions of virtue soon meets with what destroys him among so much that is evil."
And yes, this time all of the lines were addressed directly to you Pokey. And like I said if you want me to rebut all that garbage that you wrote, just say so and I will.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 5th, '06, 22:01

kotaeshiranaihito wrote:
1) you're 16, the only real world you know is the one on MTV....

.....The point is he understands people. He knows how to get people on your side, and keep them there. How can you, who never lived in the real world or even read any of his books criticize him?
good grief, condescension anyone? :lol
for someone supposedly attempting to reasonably argue points without personal attacks(i believe you had an issue with those?) you sure aren't putting your money where your mouth is... pouncing on P0KEY's age just because you don't like what she has to say smacks of immaturity and a lack of valid argument...
if you found errors in her reasoning, you could've simply stated them objectively...
all that aside, while i'm tremendously, exhaustively even, impressed with your knowledge of all things machiavellian, it doesn't much appear as though it's a view you make much use of... well, at least where the getting people on anyone's side part is concerned... it pays to practice what you preach... otherwise you just may not be taken seriously...

EDIT: oh yeah... and it may not hurt to get back on topic... :wink:

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Post by OvertheRainbow » Feb 5th, '06, 22:04

hmm..I wonder if this arguement is even about the original topic anymore xP

but heated debates are fun

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 5th, '06, 22:19

I didn't attack her age (well maybe a little :lol ), I was just addressing the fact that she shouldn't criticize someone's views on the world when she never truly experienced it. But I guess what I wrote was truly vindictive. I was probably mad at the fact she attacked my idol. So I'm sorry for that.

lol, I guess overtheraindow is the smartest one here at the moment. 8)

It seems like we're (me included of course) not doing anything other than picking apart each others lines, interpreting them how we want to and then accusing the other person with it. Now I know how politicians feel. Let's just agree to disagree on certain things because what we're doing is getting us nowhere (but if anyone truly wants to continue, we can just PM each other, or do it on AIM-doesn't have to be your main SN just make one up for conversations like these).

Now back on topic, how to make girls like you.

Well as I wrote, no one respects pushovers, and if a person doesn't respect you there is no way you can have a relationship or even friendship for that matter. And according to Machiavelli, a person's respect is more important than a person's love, but you should always strive for both.

And also if you're young be more impulsive, if your older be more prudent.

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Post by whisperss_57 » Feb 5th, '06, 22:27

wow. half a day afteri JUST finish reading the whole thread. theres more!!

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Post by OvertheRainbow » Feb 5th, '06, 22:30

kotaeshiranaihito wrote:
lol, I guess overtheraindow is the smartest one here at the moment. 8)

I
Sweet! :P

I have no idea about the whole love stuff and I feel like barfing everytime my 15-year friend starts writing about his " love crisis" and start putting quotes on his page about his love for someone

But I know that if there's someone I don't like, he can follow his heart all he wants, Im still not gonna like him... And like someone said on this board, sometimes you do have to change a little bit of yourself if its for the better

But, what do I know

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Post by x_XJules » Feb 5th, '06, 22:35

compromise is esstenial :wink:
Last edited by x_XJules on Feb 7th, '06, 11:44, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 5th, '06, 22:41

:lol all is fair in love and war, eh?
but i think most of us have seen the light on being off topic... no need to stir things up again, especially since kotaeshiranaihito's latest post was far from inflammatory...
let's keep the turf wars on the playground, ne? :wink:

EDIT: damn, off topic again.... :P but since not many new views on the subject have arisen... i'm off to bed...

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Post by neoyori » Feb 5th, '06, 22:46

Wow you guys have so much freetime to says so much stuffs ^_^" "life is life" is all i can say for you guys to understand how pitiful this guide is!

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Post by kotaeshiranaihito » Feb 5th, '06, 23:00

deleted

once again I agree with overtherainbow.
Last edited by kotaeshiranaihito on Feb 6th, '06, 23:42, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Mythrel » Feb 5th, '06, 23:18

For someone who wants to stay on topic you sure stay off it a lot. Friends don't stick up for other friends in your world? You were attacking her simply because of her age. For someone at 16 to be having a debate with you, you really believe she grew up in an MTV world? I guess thats the point where the debate ended. So she has different views of your idol, you want pity? You then took a personal attack against her, shows maturity (end sarcasm). Oh well I guess its time for this topic to get back on topic, but of course it never does.

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Post by neptunez » Feb 5th, '06, 23:40

so i came here for the guide to making girls like me...yet all i've gotten from kotaeshiranaihito is a guide to making girls hate me.

for those guys who depend on being the 'nice guy," you'll be sorely disappointed if you go out of your way to "prove" you're a nice guy. just like love, friendship, and even respect...you shouldn't have to prove it to anyone. if truly there, hopefully, it will come naturally otherwise things weren't meant to be.

don't knock the dorama...life is a drama too. just wish i could be a hottie too. but then again, life isn't a fairytale...at least for me. :wub:

(sings The Magic Numbers - Love's a Game)
Love is just a game
Broken all the same
And I will get over you
Love is just a lie
Happens all the time
Swear I know this much is true

And maybe I'm a fool for walking in line...

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Post by P0KEY » Feb 6th, '06, 03:01

neptunez wrote:so i came here for the guide to making girls like me...yet all i've gotten from kotaeshiranaihito is a guide to making girls hate me..
dude, you made me almost pee in my pants. yes, it was THAT funny. kudos to you :salut:

haha, it is getting off topic! :lol my, my, my, this is what happens when you get carried away.. gomen na and 对不起! :mrgreen: but gosh, i do love debates :wub:

and to kotaeshiranaihito- i did do some research online about your idol (and yes those paragraphs where from websites because thats where i read them from), and after the research and after talking to a few politically inclined friends of mine, i do believe that people get a negative connotation from Machiavelli.

and i do hope that my posts were not "garbage", and i certainly did not throw random words together because i was angry. i just bolded words more than usual to emphasize the point i was trying to make. and i do hope that my posts did, in fact, make sense to some people, if not to you--it certainly made sense to me! :lol but please don`t rebut this one, i wouldn`t want to take lots of time to type up another lengthy "analysis" or rebuttal to your rebuttal. :goggle: for you to say that my post was garbage indeed insults me, because i take my time and effort to type up my opinion, and to educate you on the flaws of your argument. i do not regard your posts as garbage, because each person has something he/she believes in, and i`m typing up what i think, and for you to degrade it like garbage is very insulting. you can regard my posts as garbage, or don`t even follow them, but telling straight-out what i wrote is garbage offends me. i certainly do not say that your posts (or anyone else`s posts) are garbage, because i understand that they take their time to post on a subject they can relate with. so if what i type up is garbage, so i guess what you type up is diamonds.

i think i took your argument apart piece by piece because there were flaws within it, but i did not point out my opinion (which i apologize for), but your argument is one that i definitely do not agree with, and seeing flaws in your argument makes me believe that your argument is one that i do not have to agree with, for it is flawed :-) if it were a perfect guide (which i get the feeling you think it is), then i would have to believe it, for it will be the "harsh reality". but nothing is flawless! :lol

and for you to attack my age is insulting and offending and i am none other than very annoyed at your weak attempt to degrade me. i`m 16. so what? get over it. and thinking the only real world i know is the one on MTV makes me seriously want to punch you in the face, because you don`t know me, and you don`t know what i`ve gone through in life, or what experiences i`ve had. do you stereotype all 16 year olds to be like this? talk about someone who doesn`t do personal attacks....
:x :x thats the only thing in your post that pissed me off; don`t pretend you know me, just because you were once a MTV little 16 year old jackass. criticize me when you know me better. and seriously, that was cheap, attacking my age when you realized you have nothing else to attack.

and about your idol, Machiavelli again, i am not in the position to criticize him, but i posted my opinion of him from my research. And I did mention that I respect him as your idol, but that doesn`t necessarily make me have to like him, or have him as my idol. From what I read, your idol has flaws, but hey, who doesn`t? maybe my research was bad, and the people i talked to were biased, but now i have an idea who and what Machiavelli is, and it isn`t the same as yours. i strongly apologize for comparing him to hitler, but that is the idea i got from talking to others and my research. :-) gomen na!

back on topic!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :O
its hard to make someone do anything, especially for something like "like" or "love". i guess it`s just kind of go with the flow, and dramas are fake; something like that will never happen in real life (haha, that`s why we watch them!! to see what "could" happen, but never will XD) ah i`m evil :P if someone tried to make me like them, i`d get scared and run away XD speaking from personal experience, stalkers suck. :glare: but i think everyone knows that already :P there are just too many people all with different personalities to actually make a guide to make people like someone else; it`d be funny if one actually came out, i would totally buy it for the laughs >_______<

and @ overtherainbow- JOE IS SO AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!! :wub: :wub: :wub: :wub: :wub: :wub: :wub: :: points avidly at her avator ::. err, sorry :offtopic: :P

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bugsie
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Post by bugsie » Feb 6th, '06, 04:59

maybe we should change the name of the thread to "kotaeshiranaihito vs. the d-addicts singles ranting thread team".

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Post by milleu87 » Feb 6th, '06, 05:12

yes.maybe we should do that.

the only part on the guide making girl likes you has been too little

i'm getting sick reading machiavelli's opinion actually right now. i didn't know that machiavelli's principle can be apply to girl. it sounds as if making a girl likes you is like conquering and glory be blessed upon you

lets go back to the topic ne? no more ranting about about machiavelli's principle.

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Post by liaaf » Feb 6th, '06, 05:42

hmm....great guide we have going here.....

well getting back on topic....
MY guide on making girls like you would be:

Step 1: Be good looking! (looks are always a plus)

Step 2: Have a likeable personality. (jus be freakin normal lol)

Step 3: Have a goal in life. (people in general don't look too highly on bums hehe)

thats it and with this u should be able to win any girl over =D

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Post by Xi@h » Feb 6th, '06, 10:49

:offtopic:

No offence here but I'm definately backing pokey and jules here. Oh Mythrel, good god, as always!! You know what I mean LOL

On Topic post

There are no guide actually to make a girl like you. Life is not as simple as that for making a guide, most guide cannot be applied 100% to real life, just like theories cannot be applied to practical issues.

I would just say that live your life as it is, everything has it times. She'll like you when the time is right, so don't push for it. Patience is a virtue.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 6th, '06, 12:51

Actually, i think it's best to accept the fact that not every man/woman you become enamoured with will like you back... even patience can't help in some cases...
most you can do is put forth your best effort and be yourself, then if it doesn't work out, at least you know you tried... so relationships are effectively like just about anything else in life, nobody enjoys only successes...
it also doesn't hurt to be able to identify a lost cause, rather than waste away time hoping for something that won't happen... wishful thinking is your enemy... :P
and generally where a guide of making someone like you comes in... that in itself sounds like a setup for failure, because all the advice on what to say and do is a load of crap if these things don't come naturally to you... pretending you're someone you aren't may work for undercover operatives, in love it just isn't a great idea unless the objective is simply to get into someone's pants... :P

a little side note on the "hey, don't mess with our friend" bit... it's one thing to come to a friend's defense and negate whatever false statements were made about him/her, but this ganging up reminds me suspiciously of playground posing aimed at letting the other party know he stands alone, you guys aren't children having to throw your meager weight around in a group are you? besides, it looks to me like P0KEY can take pretty good care of herself... :wink:

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Post by Mythrel » Feb 6th, '06, 16:55

:offtopic: You know Ironicwave that is the exact reason why I didn't come to Valcuns defense because I knew they would assume I was just helping him because I had to. I am sorry but I posted here with my own free will. I would have spoken out if he had made that ridiclous statement to you so don't think its for fun. It may look that way, but is it not within reason that, that they wouldn't agree with what he said? He didn't continue the debate he decided to defend his idol and poke insults at her, thats childish if you ask me. Of course I am going to speak out. I want him to know I don't agree with it and I guess, so did Jules, but even you defended her. I don't just defend my friends and if they are wrong I am not going to pretend to agree.
Last edited by Mythrel on Feb 6th, '06, 17:32, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by pokute » Feb 6th, '06, 17:13

Just for the record, Machiavelli's The Prince (Il Principe) was lifted whole from an ancient Indian document known as the Arthashastra, generally rendered into English as "The Art of Politics". The original document was written (estimates of original authorship date average around 1000 BCE) in order to show how to acquire and maintain control as a ruler by purely mechanical means, that is to say, as if from a cookbook, and independent of the abilities or worthiness of any individual ruler. Machiavelli recast the role of the ruler somewhat in the interest of flattering his patron (applying principals from the Arthashatra himself).

Seems oddly apt. And by the way, I think this topic is one of the stupidest, most misogynistic things I have ever seen here. Somebody needs therapy.

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Post by Spike23 » Feb 6th, '06, 17:24

Moenyc2000 wrote:LOL, with that sort of advice, all the guys will be single for the rest of their lives. I suggest you read double your dating, by David D. Perhaps your watching too many K-Dramas'? :lol

hahahaha yea i know seriousely =D u speak my mind.

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Post by ironicwave » Feb 6th, '06, 20:43

Mythrel wrote::offtopic: You know Ironicwave that is the exact reason why I didn't come to Valcuns defense because I knew they would assume I was just helping him because I had to. I am sorry but I posted here with my own free will. I would have spoken out if he had made that ridiclous statement to you so don't think its for fun. It may look that way, but is it not within reason that, that they wouldn't agree with what he said? He didn't continue the debate he decided to defend his idol and poke insults at her, thats childish if you ask me. Of course I am going to speak out. I want him to know I don't agree with it and I guess, so did Jules, but even you defended her. I don't just defend my friends and if they are wrong I am not going to pretend to agree.
look, no problem with jules telling him he's wrong, but what's this about "i'm not looking to pick a fight but if you post anymore nonsense then you've got another angry d-addict to deal with."
i'm not even mentally including you in the pack, because you never came off with playground threats...
then came this "No offence here but I'm definately backing pokey and jules here. Oh Mythrel, good god, as always!! You know what I mean LOL"
sorry, but either way i look at it, this is a little group of friends "coming to the rescue" where it isn't necessary...
i didn't defend P0KEY, i simply told him he was wrong to hide his lack of arguments behind the issue of her age...
but you don't see me bringing in my posse to back me up, do you?
i'm not a fan of mob mentality and i like things to remain in the mainframe of adult conversation, none of us here are kindergarten age, so none of us need act like it...

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Re: A Guide on Making Girls Like You.

Post by Daisukimaru » Mar 31st, '06, 05:34

bugsie wrote:
Valcun wrote: FOLLOW YOUR HEART AND YOU WILL NEVER GO WRONG!!! XD !!!!!!!!!!!!!
here's an idea, "follow your mom and you will never go wrong".
LMFAO

im still in highschool but i think if a guy doing that follow your heart stuff i guess he is looking for marriage because if you do that follow your heart stuff and you get "sex" than break up blah blah blah... its the almost the same thing what "players" do just that they dont get hurt emotionally as much.

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Post by qilver » Apr 6th, '06, 21:37

i guess the best advice is to be yourself, and honest. Dating comes and goes, hopefully it will stick around, as heartbreaks suck. But, hey that is life. Being one of the older ones around here, i would know, and have the relationship experience. Love can be a game, if you make it a game. Be real and upfront, no games, just honestly., no BS. :mrgreen:

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Post by abcd99 » Apr 16th, '06, 20:39

Get to know the girls' heart

And that's it! :mrgreen:
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Post by is2hyolee » Apr 18th, '06, 17:00

... just be yourself, none of that fake crap, easy as that ...

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Post by Genmai_cha » Apr 19th, '06, 16:16

Oh, boy... this is a funny thread. I thought it was some love potion he was making when I saw the topic. GOOD READ! Thank you ALL! :lol
aznsixiang wrote:
Scandalous wrote:its heartless to say, but chicks need to go through a few bad boys to gain insight. :salut:
i agree because no matter how you say it, experience is still the best teacher of them all. Saying a bunch of stuff to someone about something as complicated as this is pretty useless. These type of relationships are pretty much built on on the spot improvising and talking simply about it without being able to impart real understanding of the mechanics of it isn't enough.
I have to agreed here but by that time it is already too late and that is the part where it really sucks. You know what I mean? :-(

A point I would like to add about being a nice guy--from most of my experience, being a nice guy is not enough because after all you are just a nice guy.

Being yourself is probably the best simple guideline w/o going into too much detail.

Rejection is part of life... you lose some and you win some. Don't be afraid and you'll be surprise! :thumleft:

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Post by bomber1122 » Jan 13th, '10, 12:37

be yourself and dont worry how she cares about it, cuz when u do she will notice it and start having contorl

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Post by HongKongChick » Mar 17th, '10, 22:44

be yourself, be confident.

1. you dont want someone who is in love with your "fake" persona, so be yourself. find someone who likes you for who u are
2. a guy who isnt confident screams coward. but there is a thin line between confidence and cockiness

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Post by Fantastical » Mar 19th, '10, 05:06

HongKongChick wrote:be yourself, be confident.

1. you dont want someone who is in love with your "fake" persona, so be yourself. find someone who likes you for who u are
2. a guy who isnt confident screams coward. but there is a thin line between confidence and cockiness
cockiness? I think the word you are looking for is dick.
Last edited by Fantastical on Mar 19th, '10, 17:36, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by HongKongChick » Mar 19th, '10, 17:24

Fantastical wrote: cockiness? I dick the word you are looking for is dick.
haha yes

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Post by wsim » Mar 20th, '10, 17:12

Sounds cheesy but true, I guess....

I know that most of my friends have found relationships through being honest, true to themselves and going with the flow. I have screwed up with a couple of girls in the past by awkwardness as a result of not being confident enough.

But I guess these things take time. I haven't met the right people yet, I suppose. I am more confident now and staying true to myself, but still no luck. My time isn't quite now, apparently, haha.

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Post by HongKongChick » Mar 20th, '10, 17:28

yea, timing is also very important, but timing isnt always in our control.

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Post by Fantastical » Mar 22nd, '10, 03:24

wsim wrote:Sounds cheesy but true, I guess....

I know that most of my friends have found relationships through being honest, true to themselves and going with the flow. I have screwed up with a couple of girls in the past by awkwardness as a result of not being confident enough.

But I guess these things take time. I haven't met the right people yet, I suppose. I am more confident now and staying true to myself, but still no luck. My time isn't quite now, apparently, haha.
I know exactly how you felt. It sucks bawls when you try to talk to someone but wht you wan to say and what dribbles out of your mouth doesn't match.

The way I got over shyness is to keep talking to other women and men.
total strangers. strike up a conversation with no agenda. Just talk. You can see nervousness and anxiety. It looks desperate and scary. Any person you talk to should be treated the same way you normally would talk to them. SO do that. If you wanna add lines or a wingman or any of that stuff try that for later. Hell in fact. be somebody's else wingman and talk them up. Make the other person sound good. The whole point of being able to talk to someone you are attracted to is not use cheesy lines unless it's part of a gag. still don't do it. and if you use that fell from heaven line so help me god I will......breathe...breathe...

If you feel it's complicated then it is. if you feel it's simple then it is.
You know what....

run a scenario and ask HKC out on a date. Just ask. use your own words.
Hell ...this should be done in irc or something...

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