[Discussion] Proposal Daisakusen (Operation Love)

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unknowndevices
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Post by unknowndevices » Jun 19th, '07, 08:13

lunargen wrote: heehee... i'll try to be as fast as i could, but i can't really guarantee that heeheehee.... but for sure i'll finish come friday night japan time. :lol
yeah!...cool if you can try as fast as you can... :-)
anyway...do include lots of 'heavy' words and meaning for the subs... :goggle:
so that the story is really really a drama of the year to the viewers... :thumright:
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sakurachan
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Post by sakurachan » Jun 19th, '07, 08:26

Ok. So it's 10 episodes already into the story with just 1 last episode left, but I'm still quite clueless as to what it is that Rei said that Ken just doesn't understand. Does anyone want to throw out any hint?

Graben
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Post by Graben » Jun 19th, '07, 08:30

In episode 10 in the flashback in the hospital he said that he would protect her from then. That is what she means.

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 19th, '07, 08:41

Graben wrote:
In episode 10 in the flashback in the hospital he said that he would protect her from then. That is what she means.
If so, then Ken had already asked her to marry him in ep 9. What gives?

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Post by Graben » Jun 19th, '07, 08:46

He still didn't say he loved her, just "why don't you marry me", he needs to say I love you and I will protect you. that is what she wants to hear

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 19th, '07, 09:32

Graben wrote:
He still didn't say he loved her, just "why don't you marry me", he needs to say I love you and I will protect you. that is what she wants to hear
Hmm... At where I come from, a life-long marriage proposal "marry me" speaks much louder than a non-committal line like "I love you."

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Post by Graben » Jun 19th, '07, 09:44

But that is the problem he said ore to kekkon suru. A really rough marry me. not let's get married, will you marry me, just marry me.
He said I don't wan't you to go and marry me. It sounded more like he will be lonely then he really loves her with the words he chose.

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 19th, '07, 09:53

Graben wrote:But that is the problem he said ore to kekkon suru. A really rough marry me. not let's get married, will you marry me, just marry me.
He said I don't wan't you to go and marry me. It sounded more like he will be lonely then he really loves her with the words he chose.
I see. Can you tell me what is the proper way to propose a marriage in Japanese then? Well, maybe I'll find that out in episode 11 when (and if) Ken finally wins Rei over. He will, won't he?
'cause I'm kinda scare what Rei's scream might mean in the preview for episode 11.

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Post by Graben » Jun 19th, '07, 10:18

boku to kekkon shitekudasai would be better I think

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Post by richnrich » Jun 19th, '07, 11:15

auroragb wrote:
joeboygo wrote:Who can guess what that could be?
Love, Kenzou
could it be:

kenzou :heart: rei

:lol

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 19th, '07, 12:41

lunargen wrote:
XD XD omg and i thought i was the only one who noticed the latter!! they were a bit saggy, ne~ XD XD[/quote]

Well excuuuse me! Haven't you been reading about... them? Masami is like one of those pre-war treaty batteships of the Imperial Japanese Navy in that she has been deliiberately concealing her mighty guns, or at least understating their caliber (sorry, I've been stuck on the naval analogy since sailor fuku). What you've been seeing is the result of a push-down bra struggling to restrain peaks more majestic and imposing than Fuji-san. Rumor has it that she does this to avoid getting tagged with a sekushi aidoru image because she is a serious actress. Seriously.

Hate on Rei all you want. But I will not let you insult ...them. :mrgreen:

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Post by Graymouse » Jun 19th, '07, 13:16

joeboygo wrote:
lunargen wrote:
XD XD omg and i thought i was the only one who noticed the latter!! they were a bit saggy, ne~ XD XD

Well excuuuse me! Haven't you been reading about... them? Masami is like one of those pre-war treaty batteships of the Imperial Japanese Navy in that she has been deliiberately concealing her mighty guns, or at least understating their caliber (sorry, I've been stuck on the naval analogy since sailor fuku). What you've been seeing is the result of a push-down bra struggling to restrain peaks more majestic and imposing than Fuji-san. Rumor has it that she does this to avoid getting tagged with a sekushi aidoru image because she is a serious actress. Seriously.

Hate on Rei all you want. But I will not let you insult ...them. :mrgreen:
Erm, I was going to hold my tongue on this intresting topic but the Twin peaks were indeed flopping around like a fish out of water. Intresting though it seems like when you see Masami in a bathing suit that the peaks are not so majestic. Perhaps this is an opitcal illusion....or perhaps the sun got into my eyes!.... :pale:

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Post by cykeichan » Jun 19th, '07, 13:42

About the "KENZOU!!" scream...wouldn't it suck if she yelled that out because he got hit by a car or something? :O
kev

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Post by auroragb » Jun 19th, '07, 14:16

cykeichan wrote:
About the "KENZOU!!" scream...wouldn't it suck if she yelled that out because he got hit by a car or something? :O
kev
Perish the thought!! :cussing: :cussing:
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auroragb
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Post by auroragb » Jun 19th, '07, 14:19

joeboygo wrote:
lunargen wrote:XD XD omg and i thought i was the only one who noticed the latter!! they were a bit saggy, ne~ XD XD
Well excuuuse me! Haven't you been reading about... them? Masami is like one of those pre-war treaty batteships of the Imperial Japanese Navy in that she has been deliiberately concealing her mighty guns, or at least understating their caliber (sorry, I've been stuck on the naval analogy since sailor fuku). What you've been seeing is the result of a push-down bra struggling to restrain peaks more majestic and imposing than Fuji-san. Rumor has it that she does this to avoid getting tagged with a sekushi aidoru image because she is a serious actress. Seriously.

Hate on Rei all you want. But I will not let you insult ...them. :mrgreen:
perhaps you mean fuji-yama? I'm not sure if Mr. Fuji likes you discussing his man boobs ;)
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aatm
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Post by aatm » Jun 19th, '07, 14:22

in regards to the comments about the...."San Onofre Power Plant"...(sorry, I'm from California and was trying to be clever)
....is everyone referring to when they were running...cuz, I mean, come on....she was running! I doubt she would've been wearing a sports bra to the event.
For those who actually speak Japanese, is there a large difference between:

俺と結婚する and 僕と結婚する? I mean, is the difference between 俺 and 僕 that huge among chlldhood friends? I mean, yeah, 俺 is a little proud....but, *shrug*, I don't know. Just curious.
And yes, it would suck if the "Kenzoooooo" was her getting hit by a car, or falling off a cliff or something....."Kennzooooooooooooo.
[/spoiler]

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Post by No_Moon » Jun 19th, '07, 14:35

@aatm:
aatm wrote:For those who actually speak Japanese, is there a large difference between:

俺と結婚する and 僕と結婚する? I mean, is the difference between 俺 and 僕 that huge among chlldhood friends? I mean, yeah, 俺 is a little proud....but, *shrug*, I don't know. Just curious.
Yup, actually there kind of is if you take this completely out of its context. To put it really really figuratively, "ore to kekkon suru" is like saying it in some commanding, cavemanish "me man you be wife now" sort of way... XDD
The preferable "boku to kekkon suru" is slightly less imposing and makes it seem more like he's ordering her, but at the same time he sort of respects her. More like "marry me now" than the aforementioned caveman speak. ^^;;;

But as someone mentioned earlier, Rei and Ken have grown up in present-time Japan as very close childhood friends. Putting what Ken said back into its context, it says to Rei that he is still attached to her as a boy and not as a man. IF he were a man, he would have switched to more formal language when asking about such an important event in her life. He would have showed that he respects her as well as loves her with his words, but he didn't, and that's why she got pissed. (In Japanese formal language can sometimes be used represent the importance of an event, congratulations, etc.)

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Post by auroragb » Jun 19th, '07, 14:40

I'm hoping that
in ep 11, Kenzou will call in the childhood promise. Where she had already accepted his proposal. Rei will be all like "NOW you remember?!? Why didn't you remember before?!"
ARRGGGHH! I'm thinking more and more how cykeichan's scenario will be more likely
but I think that Kenzou will not die from it, but it will be a convenient way of Rei mirroring the promise of taking care of him for the rest of his life if he doesn't recover. An effective way of not having a wedding between Kenzou and Rei, whether or not Kenzou recovers from it
:cussing: :cussing: :cussing:
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Post by lunargen » Jun 19th, '07, 16:00

joeboygo wrote:
lunargen wrote:
XD XD omg and i thought i was the only one who noticed the latter!! they were a bit saggy, ne~ XD XD
Well excuuuse me! Haven't you been reading about... them? Masami is like one of those pre-war treaty batteships of the Imperial Japanese Navy in that she has been deliiberately concealing her mighty guns, or at least understating their caliber (sorry, I've been stuck on the naval analogy since sailor fuku). What you've been seeing is the result of a push-down bra struggling to restrain peaks more majestic and imposing than Fuji-san. Rumor has it that she does this to avoid getting tagged with a sekushi aidoru image because she is a serious actress. Seriously.

Hate on Rei all you want. But I will not let you insult ...them. :mrgreen:
CHOTTO!! XD

okay first of all, that wasn't meant to insult. It was an observation, nothing more. Yes, I hate Rei, but that doesn't mean I hate Masami. XD

----

and omg what's with these rei-dies-in-an-accident theories?!? *shudder*
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Post by joeboygo » Jun 19th, '07, 16:33

lunargen wrote:and omg what's with these rei-dies-in-an-accident theories?!? *shudder*
Yeah, what is it with this relentless pessimism? People have grown too scared of disappointment to hope for the best. Well, I'm going to be fearless with my expectations and lay it all on the line. Here's what I want to and believe will happen.

The writers and director have the audience primed for an explosive release of exhilaration, having built up an enormous amount of hope and anticipation since episode 6. It's like a bottle of champagne. I can't imagine that they would waste all that stored energy by letting it fizzle out gradually, like so many wet farts. Instead, I believe they are going to pop that cork and let the pressure escape in one climactic burst.

I predict that when Rei and Kenzou finally get together (and they will, they will) it isn't going to be dainty and gentle, as in "oops sorry, I like you after all." It's going to be sudden, sweaty, and a little violent, as in "get in my pants NOW!" Rei will probably not let Tada down gently. I think she'll dump the clown so fast, he'll hover briefly in mid-air before crashing to the ground, just like in the roadrunner cartoons. And she's not going to walk towards Kenzou. If that scream in the teaser is any indication, she's going to run full speed at him (I'm glad she's properly cushioned for such a collision).

And if any of you are looking for portents, I think Eri and Tsuru kissing were just the opening act to warm the viewers up for the headliners. I predict there will be another big kissing scene, and as I stated previously, girlfriend's gonna get some tongue. Back in episode 5, Ken shouted "goooaal" after the big score. In epsiode 11, I believe the audience will do the shouting for him, because his mouth will be full.

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Post by Molenir » Jun 19th, '07, 16:48

Just started watching this series, finished episode 1 now starting episode 2.

Based just one the first episode, I have to say its irritating to me how pathetic Ken is. While Ken and Rei were talking after the game, I kept thinking, quit acting all proud and proper and just tell the girl your sorry you failed, and that you love her. Bam instant girlfriend. History is changed, the future is changed. But no, he continues to show his cowardice by not confessing his love.

Yeah, yeah I know then there would have been just 1 or 2 episodes rather then 11. But wouldn't it have made for a nice change?

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Post by fastat3m » Jun 19th, '07, 17:15

my thoughts
[/spoiler]I'm pretty sure they'll end up together some how. I'm sure at the beginning of the episode, she'll feel conflicted and won't know what to do after he tells her not to get married. He'll probably start crying after that. The ring on the DKNY sign comes into play some how, otherwise there would be no point of finding it. To me, it is foreshadowing an event. I bet he tells mikio and somehow they figure out that the ring on the sign was the one Ken had bought for Rei and eventually Eri tells Rei. I think eventually Rei puts the ring on. Maybe she is wearing it without Ken knowing and he gets the shock of his life. I'm not sure what is going to happen, but I know that the ring comes in play somewhere during the last episode. Putting the ring on the sign and having a friend find it has to have some type of purpose.[/spoiler]
Last edited by fastat3m on Jun 19th, '07, 19:35, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by kassandora » Jun 19th, '07, 17:18

Molenir wrote:Just started watching this series, finished episode 1 now starting episode 2.

Based just one the first episode, I have to say its irritating to me how pathetic Ken is. While Ken and Rei were talking after the game, I kept thinking, quit acting all proud and proper and just tell the girl your sorry you failed, and that you love her. Bam instant girlfriend. History is changed, the future is changed. But no, he continues to show his cowardice by not confessing his love.

Yeah, yeah I know then there would have been just 1 or 2 episodes rather then 11. But wouldn't it have made for a nice change?
Yeah..no offense but kenzou had his own problems..

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Post by aatm » Jun 19th, '07, 17:29

I was joking about Rei falling off a cliff...

And while I thought that Tsuru and Eri's kiss was done pretty well, I'll take my usual stance and say that I don't think there'll be more tongue action between them...well, not more tongue action, as there hasn't been any yet, but you know what I mean.

I'll go with what someone said before about Ken leaving in the middle of the ceremony or maybe something with Ken leaving, and Rei shouting after him...cuz I mean...along with Rei falling off a cliff, I think it'd be weird if he was standing next to her and she just shouted "Kenzo!" at him.

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Post by lailoken » Jun 19th, '07, 18:29

joeboygo wrote:
lunargen wrote:and omg what's with these rei-dies-in-an-accident theories?!? *shudder*
Yeah, what is it with this relentless pessimism? People have grown too scared of disappointment to hope for the best. Well, I'm going to be fearless with my expectations and lay it all on the line. Here's what I want to and believe will happen.

The writers and director have the audience primed for an explosive release of exhilaration, having built up an enormous amount of hope and anticipation since episode 6. It's like a bottle of champagne. I can't imagine that they would waste all that stored energy by letting it fizzle out gradually, like so many wet farts. Instead, I believe they are going to pop that cork and let the pressure escape in one climactic burst.

I predict that when Rei and Kenzou finally get together (and they will, they will) it isn't going to be dainty and gentle, as in "oops sorry, I like you after all." It's going to be sudden, sweaty, and a little violent, as in "get in my pants NOW!" Rei will probably not let Tada down gently. I think she'll dump the clown so fast, he'll hover briefly in mid-air before crashing to the ground, just like in the roadrunner cartoons. And she's not going to walk towards Kenzou. If that scream in the teaser is any indication, she's going to run full speed at him (I'm glad she's properly cushioned for such a collision).

And if any of you are looking for portents, I think Eri and Tsuru kissing were just the opening act to warm the viewers up for the headliners. I predict there will be another big kissing scene, and as I stated previously, girlfriend's gonna get some tongue. Back in episode 5, Ken shouted "goooaal" after the big score. In epsiode 11, I believe the audience will do the shouting for him, because his mouth will be full.
You're prediction sounds like something that would happen in the OC... not some J-drama... BUT I LIKE IT!!!

Lets hope we get a sex scene too lol...

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Post by xunknownz » Jun 19th, '07, 18:35

i doubt we will get a sex scene... this is not av drama.. lol.. the drama plot is well rewritten and u cant guess wad he will do next. i wanna watch episode 10 wif subs! this is seriously the best drama of the yr has to offer.

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Post by kilaalaa » Jun 19th, '07, 21:02

I'm finally here! Its so torturous to be stuck without internet access all these days knowing full well that Episode 10 has aired in Japan and I can't even watch it.

But anyway!
I loved loved loved loved little Ken and Rei. Aren't they the cutest things ever? And what little Ken said was so sweet! (Even though the acting was a little bad. LOL) But you could see little Rei was so happy. Must be because she always wanted to be little Ken's bride.

GAH! But back to the nasty stuff. I don't know why but I'm really turned off by Tada. In my mind,
Tada = cockroach. LOL. XD Anyway I really hated his little speech when Rei was about to tell him why she cried on her 20th birthday.

I'm a little worried by the length of his little speech. It is so long that it ALMOST SEEMS important? Like I can so imagine an evil scriptwriter who would turn that scene into justification that Tada is a better fit for Rei because Tada is part of her future, while Ken was just an important part of her past.

Regardless of this, I'm still convinced that it will be a happy ending. (All because of joeboygo's brainwashing of a romantic comedy happy ending. HAHAHA XD) I guess I'm just being neurotic. LOL I don't think I'll ever stop worrying for Ken and Rei until they really tie the knot and FINITO FOR TADA!

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Post by auroragb » Jun 19th, '07, 21:25

It would be cool if they did a little fan service skit where Tada was a evil mastermind from the future (an anti-fairy) out to trick the princess (Rei) into marrying him. Prince Kenzou foiled his dastardly scheme and Tada transforms into his original form (with a cape and smoke and evil lighting and maniacal laughter) and they proceed to have a boss battle (a la final fantasy) and Tada gets appropriately gutted (Mortal Kombat style).
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Post by kilaalaa » Jun 19th, '07, 21:50

^ I want to see someone spray insecticide on Tada like he's a cockroach. LOL HAHAAHAHA

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Post by belleza » Jun 19th, '07, 23:22

Yeah, yeah I know then there would have been just 1 or 2 episodes rather then 11. But wouldn't it have made for a nice change?
What I love about ProDai (besides, erm, the naval insect porn fantasies) is how it depicts the self-absorption that goes with being deeply in love. The way simple actions and throwaway words become chapter titles in your autobiography. How the inevitable highs and lows chatter away in your monkey mind. How intensely that voice can sing in your head, so much so, that you feel everything, but say nothing. You get to see their past from Ken's lovesick eyes (and pretty much only from his) for an entire season; it's endearing, a little suffocating, and not entirely fair from a dramatic standpoint. But rarely will you have a show where you can emphasize with the lead romantic hero to the point where you can see the Other as he sees her. You fall in love with Rei a little, or you hate Rei a lot. But you do so intimately abiding by Ken's feelings.

And along the way, it's also about seeing your circle of friends grow up. Eri's maybe the best character on the show. As she soaks in the humbling lessons of real expectations, the prejudice of her proud youth preps for deeper, much fonder love.

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 19th, '07, 23:22

kilaalaa wrote:
Anyway I really hated his little speech when Rei was about to tell him why she cried on her 20th birthday.

I'm a little worried by the length of his little speech. It is so long that it ALMOST SEEMS important? Like I can so imagine an evil scriptwriter who would turn that scene into justification that Tada is a better fit for Rei because Tada is part of her future, while Ken was just an important part of her past.
*sighs* It looks like I have to hold your hand for one more week. Tada's little speech actually lays the foundation for his inexorable defeat because it shows precisely why he is the wrongest guy in the world for Rei. (This is going to be long, but what the hell, next week we won't have anything to talk about anymore.)
I don't wanna be captain obvious, but if there's one clear insight we can take from all of Ken's time slipping, it is that the key to the future lies in the past. It's a constantly recurring theme.

The past is such a huge part of who Rei and Ken are, and knowing where they came from makes them both familiar and warmer to us. This is particularly true for Rei. We know her jiji and the rest of her family. We saw her baby pics and drawings, we know why she became an architect. As a result, long after the show is over you will remember Ken and Rei fondly and wonder how they are currently doing as if you knew them for real.

On the other hand, Tada is such an insipid character because he doesn't appear to have any kind of history. Cherished memories, close family or friends, strong attachments, roots, traditions = zip, zero, bupkiss (or as Lunargen would say, bokya). It's why we can't get a handle on him. It's as if somebody injected Fujiki Naohito's corpse with reanimation fluid, (It's alive! It's alive!), gave it a name (Arise Tada, arise!) and turned it loose on Rei. (Beep. Target acquired. Beep)

But the worst thing about Tada isn't that he lacks a past. It's that he isn't much interested in Rei's past either. He didn't suck up to Rei's parental units for approval. Just days before the wedding, yet her worried father had no clue what robot factory Tada came from. Then, when Rei tried to tell Tada why she was crying that night, he cut her off and said it wasn't important. He did not realize that she was giving him a golden opportunity to know her better.

Contrast Tada's indifference to history with Kenzou's newfound appreciation for the past he and Rei share. He understood how crucial it was to find Randy Bass, he knew how important it was for Rei to say goodbye to jiji, etc. At her parents' house, he reflected on how marrying somebody also meant marrying that person's family. Rei's parents were comfortable with him, and her mom appeared very fond of him. But the clincher for me was that jiji entrusted Rei to Kenzou - continuity between the past, present and future. You realize that the Japanese worship their dead ancestors and pray to them, don't you?

Small wonder then that the key to Ken's victory appears to lie in something that happened when he and Rei were kids.
That's why when I heard Tada launch into that schpiel, all I could think was "Oh he dead. He be so dead."
Last edited by joeboygo on Jun 19th, '07, 23:36, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by chickenruns » Jun 19th, '07, 23:31

i don't think we should blame Tada although he's plain with a nerdy look and sometimes does things in bad timing. the problem is on Rei, does this girl really acknowledge of who she is, what she wants and how to do things. it seems that she's manipulating people, knowing that there're 2 guys always waggle behind. it's irritating. if i was the fairy, i'd make Ken get married to la bomba Cameron ('my body is sexy' !) and Rei is with Tada so they can do calculation forever. period !

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Post by belleza » Jun 19th, '07, 23:55

i don't think we should blame Tada although he's plain with a nerdy look and sometimes does things in bad timing
I actually think Tada's the most sane male character in the show. It's just weird hating on a person who actually tried to develop a honest, fair relationship with Rei, and who is so destined to "lose" because he can't overcome the "history" of his "rival."

That said, the story has always been about Rei. She chose Tada because there was no past, because he could see her anew and treat her as an adult. She made him her rite of passage, which she may have mistaken for love.

How Kenzou feels now, Rei had felt for more than 10 years. Ken doesn't realize that Rei's decision to start with Tada was deliberately to put away her feelings for Ken. She made the decision on her own, and he has to see that before the change can happen.

I just want a honest conclusion. And a scene where Pi and Kame together. That would rock! :D

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Post by vtx » Jun 20th, '07, 02:50

kilaalaa wrote:I'm finally here! Its so torturous to be stuck without internet access all these days knowing full well that Episode 10 has aired in Japan and I can't even watch it.

But anyway!
I loved loved loved loved little Ken and Rei. Aren't they the cutest things ever? And what little Ken said was so sweet! (Even though the acting was a little bad. LOL) But you could see little Rei was so happy. Must be because she always wanted to be little Ken's bride.

GAH! But back to the nasty stuff. I don't know why but I'm really turned off by Tada. In my mind,
Tada = cockroach. LOL. XD Anyway I really hated his little speech when Rei was about to tell him why she cried on her 20th birthday.

I'm a little worried by the length of his little speech. It is so long that it ALMOST SEEMS important? Like I can so imagine an evil scriptwriter who would turn that scene into justification that Tada is a better fit for Rei because Tada is part of her future, while Ken was just an important part of her past.

Regardless of this, I'm still convinced that it will be a happy ending. (All because of joeboygo's brainwashing of a romantic comedy happy ending. HAHAHA XD) I guess I'm just being neurotic. LOL I don't think I'll ever stop worrying for Ken and Rei until they really tie the knot and FINITO FOR TADA!
Im pretty sure it's gonna be a happy touching ending too after watching ep 10 last nite.
The last 2 sec of the finale preview.... Rei shouts... KENZOUUU! :cheers: I think that says it all :D Since she didn't called him by his nick ever since the last incident i guess this is a good thing...and no i don't think it's gonna be a dying scream or anything too crazily dramatic :whistling:

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 20th, '07, 03:15

belleza wrote: I actually think Tada's the most sane male character in the show. It's just weird hating on a person who actually tried to develop a honest, fair relationship with Rei
I'm not too sure about the "honest" part. Remember a few weeks back I made a semi-big deal about what you called the little "white lie" that Rei told Tada at the wedding? She was concealing from her husband the significance of her dainibuton and the identity of its giver, who just happens to be the guy that's eventually gonna whisk her away from him. At the time I thought it wasn't Tada's fault that Rei was being dishonest with him. But after seeing episode 10 you'll find that Tada bears some responsibility as well. You can't be said to be building an honest relationship if you don't give your partner an opportunity to come clean by asking the appropriate questions. Or by shutting your trap and letting her speak when she wants to fess up. That isn't trust, it's denial. There's an old bawdy joke that says the best time to bugger an ostrich is while its head is buried in the sand. :idea: Somehow, that seems so a propos here.
belleza wrote:and who is so destined to "lose" because he can't overcome the "history" of his "rival."
I thought he was destined to lose because she was not in love with him. Full stop. She was in love with Kenzou, always had been, and maybe, always will be. You said it yourself:
belleza wrote: She chose Tada because there was no past, because he could see her anew and treat her as an adult. She made him her rite of passage, which she may have mistaken for love.
How Kenzou feels now, Rei had felt for more than 10 years. Ken doesn't realize that Rei's decision to start with Tada was deliberately to put away her feelings for Ken.

Precisely. She is, consciously or otherwise, using R2dTada as a helper droid to get over Kenzou. So the most fair and proper thing that could be done for Tada is to prevent his passionless marriage from coming to be, ne?
belleza wrote:I just want a honest conclusion.

Ditto. An honest conclusion here would be, Tada doesn't deserve it, but he's still going to get the shaft, and a sadistic good time will be had by all. I don't want them to tack on some evil motive or quality to Tada's character this late in the game so that being deserted at the altar would appear his just comeuppance. The honest to godness reality is that love contests are a zero-sum game, so for every winner, a sorry loser. As Clint Eastwood said in Unforgiven, "Deserve's got nothin to do with it." If Tada isn't an android, he will feel pain. And I want to see it. :D
belleza wrote:And a scene where Pi and Kame together. That would rock! :D
Personally, my favorite pair in this show would be...
Nagasawa Masami. :mrgreen:

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Post by kilaalaa » Jun 20th, '07, 05:25

@joeboygo: Did I tell you I love how calm you are? XD And all your insight. And everyone else on this thread too. It'll be sad when prodai ends.
joeboygo wrote: Precisely. She is, consciously or otherwise, using R2dTada as a helper droid to get over Kenzou.

Personally, my favorite pair in this show would be...
Nagasawa Masami. :mrgreen:
HAHAHAHA R2dTada made me laugh out loud literally. And Nagasawa Masami, I'm a girl and I'm envious of her pair too. HAHAHA

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Post by qsk » Jun 20th, '07, 05:44

All good things must come to an end.

Will feel sudden lost when ProDai ends.

Will have to go thru' the withdrawal symptoms when ProDai ends.

Coz am too addicted to it now. :P

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Post by qsk » Jun 20th, '07, 05:46

Actually I really liked Mikio in ProDai.

He's really kewl !!

8)

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Post by jess22 » Jun 20th, '07, 06:26

Hi all!

A question about Rei's famous, “You never understood me…”

Did Ken propose in the original timeline as well?

Because if he didn’t, then why did she say that?

Thanks!

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Post by qsk » Jun 20th, '07, 06:48

jess22 wrote:Hi all!

A question about Rei's famous, “You never understood me…”

Did Ken propose in the original timeline as well?

Because if he didn’t, then why did she say that?

Thanks!
The drama never show what happen in the original timeline. So no-one knows.
But my guess is, in the original timeline, he din't propose.

in original timeline, rei says 'you never understood me...' when ken tells her not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well.

in future timeline, ken repeats his "mistake", asking rei not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well. Resulting history repeat itself... ie Rei replies with "u never understood me..." and walks away.

but in future timeline... ken runs to hug rei, and propose to her. This time round, rei says one more time.. "u never understood me... "

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Post by PiNKYsa » Jun 20th, '07, 07:55

i have been looking at you guy's post and i reli like u guy's insights haha :D
i reli hope that ken and rei will end up together, although i actually do feel bad for tada :p
well one thing i reli like about ep10 is
eri kissing tsuru!!! its juss sooooooooo sweet!!! i reli like the 2 of them together! :wub:
anyway i saw this preview/summary thing on its fujitv website and i thought i will just translate and share with u guys~ my english is not that well so please bear with me :pale:
Ken takes Rei to their elementary school where they first met. With their memories at that time all coming back to them, the two of them start to chat.

At the party, Tada is looking for Rei. Although Mikio ignored him because he knows everything, Tsuru volunteers to go look for Rei. At the same time, while Eri is preparing to leave for the party from her part time job in the burger place, she found something surprising and leaves for the party in a rush.

Rei honestly tells Ken, "Thank you for everything." However, Ken still cannot tell Rei his feeling, but he notices one thing...

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Post by belleza » Jun 20th, '07, 09:50

Remember a few weeks back I made a semi-big deal about what you called the little "white lie" that Rei told Tada at the wedding? She was concealing from her husband the significance of her dainibuton and the identity of its giver, who just happens to be the guy that's eventually gonna whisk her away from him.
I haven't seen Episode 10 yet, and so it's possible I may see Tada as very overbearing about the wedding ceremony. That white lie Rei isn't that unusual to me; I would never tell my significant other too extensively about past lovers or anything like that.
thought he was destined to lose because she was not in love with him. Full stop. She was in love with Kenzou, always had been, and maybe, always will be. You said it yourself:
I think Rei loves Ken more, that's true. But I don't think, from her point of view, it was ever as "easy" about loving Ken or not. Growing up with somebody who was neither here nor there to you, since pretty much forever, I can see her side in it. Ken and Rei don't really communicate, never have. If Ken only listened better, or if Rei simply confessed, they would have save each other a world of hurt. And, so, there must have been a mutual reason for both of them to be mutually alone in love.

Which leads to the next part . . .
Precisely. She is, consciously or otherwise, using R2dTada as a helper droid to get over Kenzou. So the most fair and proper thing that could be done for Tada is to prevent his passionless marriage from coming to be, ne?
Mmm . . . the best thing really is for Rei to finally speak her mind, and to articulate once and for all, what she really wanted. Tada gave Rei something that Ken, given their past, couldn't, an opportunity for her to act as an adult without the baggage of her past. The freedom for her to choose her future and be accepted as she is now, not what she was then. She got to start over.

I guess what I'm hoping for is for Rei to finally say something. What did Ken not understand? What friendship or relationship did she really want? I wonder Rei never really talked to her best friend Eri.

Wow, I really feel for Tada. Then again, I was the one of those who belonged to the "poor Wong Bing!! how could she do that to Wong Bing?!?" demographic during Autumn Tale. Ahhh. Childhood love is sweet; but brother-sister love is the best!! :lol :crazy:
Personally, my favorite pair in this show would be...
Doesn't she have the cutest cheeks in the world? ;) FWIW, I do hope ProDai turns you and everybody else onto Masami's work (aside from Sailor Fuku, please avoid!)

And remember kids, after all the ProDai drama is over, EVERYBODY is going to hang out at the HanaKimi thread. Stayed tuned for the madness folks ;)

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Post by Graymouse » Jun 20th, '07, 14:12

Alright guys, I watched episode 10 again three times and well I came up with my own ideas of how this emotional roller coaster drama will end. Here are some questions I would like to ask you guys. I have my own opinion on whats going to happen but I just want to see what you guys are thinking how this is going to end.
First question? Why is Ken crying at the end of the preview?

Second question? I saw Tada and Rei in their wedding tux and wedding dress. Tada looks extremely worried or heartbroken. Do you think that they were practicing getting married?

Third question? I thought at the end of episode 10 we saw Eri leave the burger place and the manager running out after her. How did Eri find the engagement ring on the sign?

Fourth question? It was at night when Eri gave the ring to Rei and we saw her reaction when she looked at it. When the orginal picture was taken it was during the day time after Tada's pary. Intresting enough Ken avoided the picture being taken for the time being but are the going to take another picture or is the story going to finish in the past so that all the events that happened in Episode 1 is null and void?

Fith question? We heard Rei yelling Kenzo at the top of her lungs at the end of the preview was this after she pretty muched dumped Tada?

sixths and final question? Why the hell are we seeing the fairy again and the look on his face was not a look of "congradulations you did it!"

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Post by myunoyume » Jun 20th, '07, 15:11

This drama is completely playing with my nerves ! Why the week is going so slowly !

Graymouse, you are not making the situation easier... I am worried for Kenzou and Rei... I want a happy ending for both of them... I don't want this drama becoming dramatic at all... not an ending like in Kurosagi...

Onegaishimasu.... :pale:
Graymouse wrote:Alright guys, I watched episode 10 again three times and well I came up with my own ideas of how this emotional roller coaster drama will end. Here are some questions I would like to ask you guys. I have my own opinion on whats going to happen but I just want to see what you guys are thinking how this is going to end.
First question? Why is Ken crying at the end of the preview?

Second question? I saw Tada and Rei in their wedding tux and wedding dress. Tada looks extremely worried or heartbroken. Do you think that they were practicing getting married?

Third question? I thought at the end of episode 10 we saw Eri leave the burger place and the manager running out after her. How did Eri find the engagement ring on the sign?

Fourth question? It was at night when Eri gave the ring to Rei and we saw her reaction when she looked at it. When the orginal picture was taken it was during the day time after Tada's pary. Intresting enough Ken avoided the picture being taken for the time being but are the going to take another picture or is the story going to finish in the past so that all the events that happened in Episode 1 is null and void?

Fith question? We heard Rei yelling Kenzo at the top of her lungs at the end of the preview was this after she pretty muched dumped Tada?

sixths and final question? Why the hell are we seeing the fairy again and the look on his face was not a look of "congradulations you did it!"

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Post by shazai » Jun 20th, '07, 15:12

Graymouse wrote:
First question? Why is Ken crying at the end of the preview?

Second question? I saw Tada and Rei in their wedding tux and wedding dress. Tada looks extremely worried or heartbroken. Do you think that they were practicing getting married?

Third question? I thought at the end of episode 10 we saw Eri leave the burger place and the manager running out after her. How did Eri find the engagement ring on the sign?

Fourth question? It was at night when Eri gave the ring to Rei and we saw her reaction when she looked at it. When the orginal picture was taken it was during the day time after Tada's pary. Intresting enough Ken avoided the picture being taken for the time being but are the going to take another picture or is the story going to finish in the past so that all the events that happened in Episode 1 is null and void?

Fith question? We heard Rei yelling Kenzo at the top of her lungs at the end of the preview was this after she pretty muched dumped Tada?

sixths and final question? Why the hell are we seeing the fairy again and the look on his face was not a look of "congradulations you did it!"
This is my answers....
1. Why is Ken crying at the end of the preview?
- I think the picture is taken and he felt sad and disappointed that he thinks he doesn't change anything.

2. I saw Tada and Rei in their wedding tux and wedding dress. Tada looks extremely worried or heartbroken. Do you think that they were practicing getting married?
- I thinks its in the present time maybe during the wedding Rei went to a room and Tada follows her or something and they talk and she politely dumps tada there.

3. thought at the end of episode 10 we saw Eri leave the burger place and the manager running out after her. How did Eri find the engagement ring on the sign?
-I think she went inside to change. (Whenever they went in the store as far as i know they are coming to the right side.) and when she went out she saw the ring and there's this scene that eri is looking at it and in the background is the shogun burger store.
Image
Image
Image

4.It was at night when Eri gave the ring to Rei and we saw her reaction when she looked at it. When the orginal picture was taken it was during the day time after Tada's pary. Intresting enough Ken avoided the picture being taken for the time being but are the going to take another picture or is the story going to finish in the past so that all the events that happened in Episode 1 is null and void?
-Either they would take a picture or the story goes on...

5.We heard Rei yelling Kenzo at the top of her lungs at the end of the preview was this after she pretty muched dumped Tada?
-As Ken said after the "you don't understand" dialogue of Rei, Rei doesn't call her Kenzo anymore. Yeah I'm sure she dump Tada.

6.Why the hell are we seeing the fairy again and the look on his face was not a look of "congradulations you did it!"
-refer to number 2
Image

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Post by dotaro » Jun 20th, '07, 15:13

My thoughts after watching Ep11 Trailer
First question? Why is Ken crying at the end of the preview?
>Rei thanked Kenzo for everything after the visit to the kindergarden, but it's impossible for them to be together.

Second question? I saw Tada and Rei in their wedding tux and wedding dress. Tada looks extremely worried or heartbroken. Do you think that they were practicing getting married?
>This is either before or after the photo-presentation & Tada-san offered to elope with Rei.

Third question? I thought at the end of episode 10 we saw Eri leave the burger place and the manager running out after her. How did Eri find the engagement ring on the sign?
>Either Tsuru/Mikio told Eri about Kenzo having bought the ring during that fateful night.

Fourth question? It was at night when Eri gave the ring to Rei and we saw her reaction when she looked at it. When the orginal picture was taken it was during the day time after Tada's pary. Intresting enough Ken avoided the picture being taken for the time being but are the going to take another picture or is the story going to finish in the past so that all the events that happened in Episode 1 is null and void?
>The picture is still taken, but without Kenzo. Kenzo crying in the kindergarden. The story will not finish in the past. The trailer shows Rei & Tada in wedding suit remember?

Fith question? We heard Rei yelling Kenzo at the top of her lungs at the end of the preview was this after she pretty muched dumped Tada?
>As much as you hope Tada to be dumped, I dun think Tada will be "dumped" in sense. Anyway, Rei is yelling at Kenzo after she found him after a search.

sixths and final question? Why the hell are we seeing the fairy again and the look on his face was not a look of "congradulations you did it!"
>This scene could be after the Final Photo.

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Post by myunoyume » Jun 20th, '07, 15:47

Just found this on the web : a summary of Ep 10 + snapshots
Good for non japanese speakers, while waiting for the subs... :w00t:
Sugoi desu ne !

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Post by jess22 » Jun 20th, '07, 16:25

qsk wrote:
jess22 wrote:Hi all!

A question about Rei's famous, “You never understood me…”

Did Ken propose in the original timeline as well?

Because if he didn’t, then why did she say that?

Thanks!
The drama never show what happen in the original timeline. So no-one knows.
But my guess is, in the original timeline, he din't propose.

in original timeline, rei says 'you never understood me...' when ken tells her not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well.

in future timeline, ken repeats his "mistake", asking rei not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well. Resulting history repeat itself... ie Rei replies with "u never understood me..." and walks away.

but in future timeline... ken runs to hug rei, and propose to her. This time round, rei says one more time.. "u never understood me... "
Thanks qsk!

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 20th, '07, 16:42

It's a bit off-topic, but it's so strange I have to mention it. Very early in this thread (on page 18 to be exact), I made a reference to the anime "Tenjou Tenge" because the sight of Eri and Rei in seifukus reminded me a lot of the way Aya and Maya were drawn in the anime - looong legs in loose socks, looong hair, boooobs. Suddenly, out of the blue, in episode 10, what do we find? A Tenjou Tenge reference! :w00t:

For those that may not have gotten what I was talkling about back then, here is a youtube link to the opening of the anime:http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YUWD4BZ81Y

Could this mean somebody from Fuji Terebi is reading this thread? If so, did I ever mention that idea of mine for an ending, where the cross at the top of the church suddenly falls and impales Tada, who is then struck by multiple bolts of lightning, leaving nary a trace behind but a smoking dark spot on the floor? It's a ratings magnet man, ratings magnet! :thumleft:

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Post by kyoichi07 » Jun 20th, '07, 17:34

jess22 wrote:
qsk wrote:
jess22 wrote:Hi all!

A question about Rei's famous, “You never understood me…”

Did Ken propose in the original timeline as well?

Because if he didn’t, then why did she say that?

Thanks!
The drama never show what happen in the original timeline. So no-one knows.
But my guess is, in the original timeline, he din't propose.

in original timeline, rei says 'you never understood me...' when ken tells her not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well.

in future timeline, ken repeats his "mistake", asking rei not to anyhow marry someone she doesn't know very well. Resulting history repeat itself... ie Rei replies with "u never understood me..." and walks away.

but in future timeline... ken runs to hug rei, and propose to her. This time round, rei says one more time.. "u never understood me... "
Thanks qsk!
When Rei said that "u never understood me..." maybe it meant that all she wanted from Ken to say that he likes her..Perhaps she didnt even need a proposal..
Since the evening when they were playing with water balloons, Ken asked Rei to go out with him if he manage to hit the can..But even though he did, she didnt go out with him, perhaps because it wasnt formal and Rei didnt get to hear what she wanted to hear from Ken. :glare:

So...."u never understood me..." meant Ken didnt realise/understand that all Rei wanted from him was just "I like you, Rei" :thumright:

Possible?

(:

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Post by master » Jun 20th, '07, 17:48

I love your comments guys even if I didn't participate in your interesting discussions... my imagination just goes too far but here is what i think after watching the whole thing (until ep10) 3 or 4 times


1st ending (probability: 59%) : Kenzou marries Rei. Yesss! Go @#@%%!!# Tada san I hate you for making kenzou so sad. Kenzou never confessed to Rei because he was just so sure that they would stay together forever: during all this time he didn't feel the need to confess to Rei because it was so obvious for him. Tada san, since he is older, had more love experience than Ken and could reach his target easily, this is simply unfair and that's why the fairy appeared.

2nd ending (probability: 40%) : Tada san effectively becomes Rei's husband. Rei calling Ken "Kenzou" in the trailer means that both agreed to keep their childhood friendship forever even if Rei is getting married. If this happens I will be sooooo sad.

3rd ending (probability: 1%) : Kenzo drank too much during ep1 and fell into ethylic coma, and the whole thing is just a dream.

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Post by belleza » Jun 20th, '07, 18:38

When Rei said that "u never understood me..." maybe it meant that all she wanted from Ken to say that he likes her..Perhaps she didnt even need a proposal..
See, I think that's the misunderstanding. Ken believes he failed because he didn't confess. But, what the past suggests, is that Ken failed because he didn't make her confess. It's about Rei -- her indecision, her own rationalizations, which prevents Ken from moving forward.

I think when Rei says "you never understood me", she is also saying that she can't explain to him how she feels, anymore than she could with her best friend Eri. She's conveyed this message through the entire show, that they're neither here nor there, that they fight for completely stupid reasons, that almost every time she gives he doesn't "get it."

Rei plainly recognized the limitations in their friendship. But, also on that level, Rei projected her own insecurities by judging Ken. What Ken has done for a day, Rei has done for 10+ years.

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Post by auroragb » Jun 20th, '07, 19:29

joeboygo wrote:It's a bit off-topic, but it's so strange I have to mention it. Very early in this thread (on page 18 to be exact), I made a reference to the anime "Tenjou Tenge" because the sight of Eri and Rei in seifukus reminded me a lot of the way Aya and Maya were drawn in the anime - looong legs in loose socks, looong hair, boooobs. Suddenly, out of the blue, in episode 10, what do we find? A Tenjou Tenge reference! :w00t:

For those that may not have gotten what I was talkling about back then, here is a youtube link to the opening of the anime:http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YUWD4BZ81Y
erm... totally missed the Tenjou Tenge reference in ep 10... help?
Jdrama Chinese fansub index 2006 | 2007

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Post by AfricanBean » Jun 20th, '07, 19:43

auroragb wrote: erm... totally missed the Tenjou Tenge reference in ep 10... help?
I believe the "Bomb A Head" song was the opening theme to Tenjou Tenge. It plays at around 31:00 minutes in.

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Post by ladysaotome » Jun 20th, '07, 21:09

master wrote:I love your comments guys even if I didn't participate in your interesting discussions... my imagination just goes too far but here is what i think after watching the whole thing (until ep10) 3 or 4 times


1st ending (probability: 59%) : Kenzou marries Rei. Yesss! Go @#@%%!!# Tada san I hate you for making kenzou so sad. Kenzou never confessed to Rei because he was just so sure that they would stay together forever: during all this time he didn't feel the need to confess to Rei because it was so obvious for him. Tada san, since he is older, had more love experience than Ken and could reach his target easily, this is simply unfair and that's why the fairy appeared.

2nd ending (probability: 40%) : Tada san effectively becomes Rei's husband. Rei calling Ken "Kenzou" in the trailer means that both agreed to keep their childhood friendship forever even if Rei is getting married. If this happens I will be sooooo sad.

3rd ending (probability: 1%) : Kenzo drank too much during ep1 and fell into ethylic coma, and the whole thing is just a dream.

Option #3 would make me soooo pissed! :cussing:

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Post by kyoichi07 » Jun 21st, '07, 04:28

I hope and I think Ken and Rei will get together.. Not sure if I saw it in this forum.. But someone did mention about the end credits that they show at the end of each episode.. Where firstly they'll just have the 5 of them..Then Toda-san comes into the picture.. But in the end.. it goes back to just the five of them listening to Kuwata Keisuke singing..Toda-san is no longer there.. Then finally.. Ken and Rei smiling happily at each other.. (:

Is it coincidence that the Opening Theme is the same as the song that Yamapi played in DragonZakura when he was in the band? And its also Nagasawa Masami and Yamapi.. And once again they are both friends since they were young.. and again.. Masami likes Yamapi.. Is it all just a coincidence?



Totally out of point, but I've actually turned into Ken. The girl I love just told me that she's getting married next sunday. Any fairy willing to help me? :cry:

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 21st, '07, 05:17

kyoichi07 wrote:
Totally out of point, but I've actually turned into Ken. The girl I love just told me that she's getting married next sunday. Any fairy willing to help me? :cry:
Um... This is just a show; it's not reality. Don't do anything stupid. It's over. Get over it and move on.

But if you truly cannot accept that, then you still have a week to ... well, only you can decide what you must do.

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Post by lunargen » Jun 21st, '07, 05:53

kyoichi07 wrote: Is it coincidence that the Opening Theme is the same as the song that Yamapi played in DragonZakura when he was in the band?
areee? really? which song? you mean mongol 800's chiisana koi no uta? *heheh i haven't seen DZ yet :lol *
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Post by aatm » Jun 21st, '07, 06:10

kyoichi07 wrote: Is it coincidence that the Opening Theme is the same as the song that Yamapi played in DragonZakura when he was in the band?
it's somewhat similar, but it's not the same.

for those interested, Dragon Zakura - Episode 1 - 20:28 vs. the opening credits (no, not Mongol 800 or Keisuke Kuwata)

It's close...not "Ice, Ice, Baby"/"Under Pressure" close, but close.

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Post by kyoichi07 » Jun 21st, '07, 06:22

sakurachan wrote:
kyoichi07 wrote:
Totally out of point, but I've actually turned into Ken. The girl I love just told me that she's getting married next sunday. Any fairy willing to help me? :cry:
Um... This is just a show; it's not reality. Don't do anything stupid. It's over. Get over it and move on.

But if you truly cannot accept that, then you still have a week to ... well, only you can decide what you must do.

Mm Thanks sakurachan.. :salut: I'm ok..Wont do anything stupid..haha..afterall i was the one who asked her to hang on to him if she really loves him.. (: I'm trying to get over it and move on.. :D

aatm wrote:
kyoichi07 wrote:
Is it coincidence that the Opening Theme is the same as the song that Yamapi played in DragonZakura when he was in the band?
it's somewhat similar, but it's not the same.

for those interested, Dragon Zakura - Episode 1 - 20:28 vs. the opening credits (no, not Mongol 800 or Keisuke Kuwata)

It's close...not "Ice, Ice, Baby"/"Under Pressure" close, but close.
oic..didnt realise that it is different..kinda sounded the same to me..haha.. :P

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Post by dee8o8 » Jun 21st, '07, 06:51

Mm Thanks sakurachan.. :salut: I'm ok..Wont do anything stupid..haha..afterall i was the one who asked her to hang on to him if she really loves him.. (: I'm trying to get over it and move on.. :D



i see im not the only "good guy"-but-the-fool-in=the-end male around here.
this kinda hits home also for me where i too wish i could go back into time and change just one thing i did. boo for me

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bl00_4ng31
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Post by bl00_4ng31 » Jun 21st, '07, 06:59

aww u guys...dont think about it like that. just because u guys have a kind heart and just wants the girl to be happy doesnt mean u guys are fools...has everyone seen Wong Fu's production of Nice Guy?( it's really good :lol

i cant wait to wait ep 10 :lol
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credit:: machibouke@LJ

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Post by belleza » Jun 21st, '07, 08:28

Is it coincidence that the Opening Theme is the same as the song that Yamapi played in DragonZakura when he was in the band? And its also Nagasawa Masami and Yamapi.. And once again they are both friends since they were young.. and again.. Masami likes Yamapi.. Is it all just a coincidence?
Oh, all that was intentional from the get-go. ProDai is primarily a star vehicle for Yamapi, where Pi finally gets the girl. Until they hit a certain age or popularity threshhold with your demographic, JE kinda forbids their idols from having "requited" relationships (i.e. no kiss!) in their show, because they don't want to alienate their female audience. He's a Johnny man now. :D ProDai is kind of his graduation ceremony, and so, much of the show plays like homages to Pi's more popular shows. I mean, Kenzou is a sober Akira, ne?

The romantic story setup is the reversal of Dragon Zakura.
Essentially, in Dragon Zakura, she's playing the Ken role and he's playing the Rei role. In the show, Masami and Pi are childhood friends (neighbors?), but Pi is dating Aragaki Yui (of My Boss My Hero.) She wants to confess, but she has no self-esteem or sense of direction. He on the other hand sort of acts like her big brother, and her mother is kinda like an aunt to him. He is proud and has dreams; she has neither.

Yui vs. Masami is like Tada vs. Ken. Yui may be Pi's girl and with his clique, but she doesn't share the past that Masami and Pi have. And in fact, Yui has reasons to be worried -- Pi still shares things with Masami that he can't with Yui, and at times in the show he asks for emotional support from Masami only, in the way Rei does with Ken during their high school days. On the other hand, Masami can't confess her feelings for him, even though the tension between them is mutual. Yui pushes herself harder onto Pi, kinda like how Tada does in the later episodes. And Masami kinda shrugs and looks miserable at the same time.

And, oh yeah, his sidekick Koike Teppei (with pitch perfect perm) is trying to win over through Saeko through the entire frigging show. Hmm, who does that remind you of? ;)

Even though the romantic arc isn't really a major part of Dragon Zakura, I loved the chemistry between the two actors. It was largely about her, the dowdy girl next door, who was in love with the coolest dude at school, the leader of the band, and the guy who whips his clique's complacent butt into shape. In other words, the character Yamapi played mirrored him as the leader of NEWS, and naturally the girl next door quietly suffered as his biggest fan.

ProDai is the flip side. It's largely about him, the awkward-at-love slouch, who is in love with, by the latest Oricon poll, Japan's Most Eligibile Bride. Her character, especially seen through the lovesick eyes of our hero Ken, mirrors Masami's career ascent to CM Queen and already one of the top romantic actresses in any age group. Ken is the 18-35 demographic who dreams of the perfect proposal with the perfect bride.
see im not the only "good guy"-but-the-fool-in=the-end male around here.
this kinda hits home also for me where i too wish i could go back into time and change just one thing i did. boo for me
Oh, you're in good company then. I think almost every guy here is pushing for Kenzou to win for the Team. Or at least Tada to explode in a ball of flames. :D

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 21st, '07, 08:51

belleza wrote: Oh, you're in good company then. I think almost every guy here is pushing for Kenzou to win for the Team. Or at least Tada to explode in a ball of flames. :D
Not me. I'm hoping Rei stays her course in having a happy marriage with Tada.* Ken will finally learn what it is that he doesn't understand about Rei and the reason why she made her choice with Tada.**

But then, having said all that, I know this is a fantasy-theme show targeted for mass audience. So the writers are almost bound to give it a "happy ending" that the general audience would accept only as a Rei X Ken ending.

* Why must a happy marriage only happen with your first choice? Why can't a happy marriage be with your second choice instead? In real life, how many marriages are actually with their respective first choice? I would even go as far as to say that in most marriages, neither side is the other's first choice. At least here we can assume that Rei was Tada's first choice. As boring as Tada may be, if his kind of man cannot make a good husband, then who can?

** Rei had stated a couple times before that she didn't choose to be with Tada just because he confessed so freely unlike Ken. And it certainly wasn't just to get back at Ken. There just isn't any indication of that. Like she said, she had given all of her teenage years into searching an answer that was not there (namely Ken) and it's time to move on to searching other answers. Then Tada came along, and she decided to try to search the answer with him, which Tada responded very promptly --- something Ken needs to learn. You might argue, as Ken did, that Tada's proposal was too quick. However, this is exactly Ken's problem: he wastes freaking too much time! When food is ready and hot, you eat it right away. You don't wait til it gets cold and then let it get spoiled. Just like the fairy, he eats his food right away right there.

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Post by belleza » Jun 21st, '07, 09:17

Why must a happy marriage only happen with your first choice? Why can't a happy marriage be with your second choice instead? In real life, how many marriages are actually with their respective first choice? I would even go as far as to say that in most marriages, neither side is the other's first choice. At least here we can assume that Rei was Tada's first choice. As boring as Tada may be, if his kind of man cannot make a good husband, then who can?
I agree, but ProDai is a junai-ish love story. And in junai, it's either first love or death.

I like Tada an awful lot, then again I like Doctor Fujita a lot. :D Tada's in line with what Rei actually enjoys, their mutual love of fanciful spaces. Their connection seems willfully intimate; Rei expresses more completely with him than any of her other friends, and Tada seems disarmingly brave around her. I think some of it has to do with the quality of the actors involved, but I almost always enjoy their scenes together.

I don't know what Rei wants, though. You can look at every episode and say Rei never
really gave Ken a fair chance. Or you can look at every episode and say Rei really did see their friendship for what it was, and that she loved Ken for who he is. And I'm sure there's other ways Rei saw them. Living in Ken's mind, though, we don't understand Rei much better than he does. Only that she doesn't know the effect her capricious distance has/had on him.

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Post by SmiLeeGirl » Jun 21st, '07, 10:35

belleza wrote:

The romantic story setup is the reversal of Dragon Zakura.
Essentially, in Dragon Zakura, she's playing the Ken role and he's playing the Rei role. In the show, Masami and Pi are childhood friends (neighbors?), but Pi is dating Aragaki Yui (of My Boss My Hero.) She wants to confess, but she has no self-esteem or sense of direction. He on the other hand sort of acts like her big brother, and her mother is kinda like an aunt to him. He is proud and has dreams; she has neither.

Yui vs. Masami is like Tada vs. Ken. Yui may be Pi's girl and with his clique, but she doesn't share the past that Masami and Pi have. And in fact, Yui has reasons to be worried -- Pi still shares things with Masami that he can't with Yui, and at times in the show he asks for emotional support from Masami only, in the way Rei does with Ken during their high school days. On the other hand, Masami can't confess her feelings for him, even though the tension between them is mutual. Yui pushes herself harder onto Pi, kinda like how Tada does in the later episodes. And Masami kinda shrugs and looks miserable at the same time.

And, oh yeah, his sidekick Koike Teppei (with pitch perfect perm) is trying to win over through Saeko through the entire frigging show. Hmm, who does that remind you of? ;)

Even though the romantic arc isn't really a major part of Dragon Zakura, I loved the chemistry between the two actors. It was largely about her, the dowdy girl next door, who was in love with the coolest dude at school, the leader of the band, and the guy who whips his clique's complacent butt into shape. In other words, the character Yamapi played mirrored him as the leader of NEWS, and naturally the girl next door quietly suffered as his biggest fan.

ProDai is the flip side. It's largely about him, the awkward-at-love slouch, who is in love with, by the latest Oricon poll, Japan's Most Eligibile Bride. Her character, especially seen through the lovesick eyes of our hero Ken, mirrors Masami's career ascent to CM Queen and already one of the top romantic actresses in any age group. Ken is the 18-35 demographic who dreams of the perfect proposal with the perfect bride.
WOW I never really thought about it like that BUT you are SOOO right. Dang now I want to watch DZ again.
My favorite part (and everyone elses I am sure ... is when she is leaning on him when her moms in the hospital. You could just feel the tension

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Post by Graymouse » Jun 21st, '07, 11:19

THREE DAYS UNTIL TADA WILL CRASH AND BURN!!!!!!!!!!! REI IS WAY OUT OF HIS LEAGUE
Last edited by Graymouse on Jun 21st, '07, 15:00, edited 3 times in total.

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 21st, '07, 14:39

belleza wrote: Their connection seems willfully intimate;
Are we watching the same show? I may have missed something important then, because when I see them together, instead of "intimate," the words that come to my mind are "formal," "stiff," "sterile" and "ballistic gelatin." I'm genuinely curious to know which scenes led you to form that impression. And after you see episode 10, you'll find additional basis for the proposition that, far from being intimate, they hardly know anything about each other.

About the only thing they share in common is the architectural profession. But you'll find in episode 5 that their design philosophies are diametrically opposed. Tada's designs are meant to require as little personal contact between the designer and the actual builders of the structure, while Rei advocates closer interaction between architect and carpenter in order to nurture and preserve the dying skills of the trade. Compare the model of Tada's design with the dream house in Rei's last "love letter" to her jiji. Tada is a modernist that eschews traditional design elements, while Rei is a traditionalist who pays conscious homage to the past.
belleza wrote: Rei expresses more completely with him than any of her other friends.
I totally missed this as well. In my own review of the show, the impression I get is, she hasn't told him squat. The one time I saw her attempt to give Tada a genuinely intimate view of her inner clockwork was in episode 10, and he wanted no part of it. But even if this were true, it isn't necessarily proof of intimacy. It may even be evidence of distance and objectivity. For example, people are usually able to tell things to their therapists, lawyers and priest-confessors that they could never say to their loved ones. Or take this very forum. I couldn't discuss this show with anybody that knows me in real life because...*shudders* let's not even go there. However, the anonymity of the internet allows me to freely express myself here as an afficionado of romantic comedies.
belleza wrote: and Tada seems disarmingly brave around her.
I will concede that Tada can be fearless, in much the same way a crash test dummy is fearless. But I have yet to see him display genuine personal courage, unless you can point me to a specific scene where this is evident.
sakurachan wrote:At least here we can assume that Rei was Tada's first choice.
Oh, but no she isn't. Check out episode 3, the scene where he hurns trash with Ken, and cross reference that with episode 10, where he and Rei check out the church reception hall.
sakurachan wrote:As boring as Tada may be, if his kind of man cannot make a good husband, then who can?
That is the central dilemma that Rei must confront. It's a very personal choice and there is no "one-size-fits-all" answer because the correct choice will vary depending on what each woman wants for herself. I pointed out earlier that Tada is the "safe" choice, so to that extent, I agree with you. He is a straight, level road; no bumps, no thrills. Ken is a riskier proposition. More twists and turns, but also more excitement. Who you favor really depends on how you want to live.
Last edited by joeboygo on Jun 21st, '07, 16:16, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by Graymouse » Jun 21st, '07, 14:59

@joe Have you watch the "dark episodes" yet? Its Friday already here in Japan and you know what that means.....3 more days until Tada gets dumped and Ken become the winner just like he predicted waaay back in episode 3!

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 21st, '07, 15:06

Yes I have. It was 2.9 hours of vicarious agony compensated by .1 hours of speedy alka seltzer relief. If they didn't throw us that bright shining little bone in the preview of episode 11 I would have started sniffing gasoline.

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Post by Graymouse » Jun 21st, '07, 15:29

@JOE.
you know when Ken noticed the scar on Rei's arm as she was being a social butterfly and when she walked out of the building and Ken was standing there with that tray. I started yelling at the tv saying "go get your girl Ken" What the hell are you waiting for" and when Ken put that tray down and ran out and grabed Rei by the arm and they ran off.. I was cheering! As they were running did you notice the look that Rei gave Ken? Finally some justice will be served!
For all you Tada pushers out there I just want to make one comment. Through my eyes Tada told Rei about everything Rei needs to know to dump him. Tada is a type of guy who lives only in the present and dreams of the future. Rei is a type of girl who the past is very important to her. She holds the past very dear to her heart and when she tried to tell Tada about her past Tada interupted her and told her that he doesn't care about her past. He is only intrested in the present and the future Rei. I my opinon that little comment no matter how inocent Tada thought it was started pushing a large wooden wedge between the couple. The past is what makes the person who they are in the present.

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Post by joeboygo » Jun 21st, '07, 15:42

Graymouse, brace yourself to have your patience tested just a wee bit more.
I suspect that when he gets her to where they are running, the idiot WILL STILL NOT BE ABLE TO SAY IT. It's an extended episode after all, so they can't have it end too quickly. I suspect the key to victory is the inscription on the band of Ken's engagement ring. And even then, Rei won't instantly change her mind after seeing it. She'll have these nagging doubts, have a final confrontation with Tada right before the wedding ceremony, dump him, then yell KENZOU!!!

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Post by sakurachan » Jun 21st, '07, 15:51

Graymouse wrote:@joe Have you watch the "dark episodes" yet? Its Friday already here in Japan and you know what that means.....3 more days until Tada gets dumped and Ken become the winner just like he predicted waaay back in episode 3!
I don't know. It's very hard for me to see how Rei can, in one episode, turns around completely and go with Ken. I don't see what Ken can do to change her stand anyway.

Look. If there is anything Ken can still do, something that Rei is still waiting for, then she would've been still waiting for Ken. However, this is not the case.

Back in episode 6, she already gave that up. She moved on. And she is the kind of person who stays her course, as commented by Eri a few times in the past. It would be very much out of her character to go breakup with Tada at their wedding and runs off with Ken.

The writers will need some very drastic event to take place, like Ken getting run over by a bus chasing after Rei or something, in order to change her course. Anything less would make the story rushed and inconsistent.

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Post by hadmish » Jun 21st, '07, 15:56

joeboygo, man, you've been watching a lot of Jdoramas huh? (same here....)

its too funny coz I totally agree with you, if its gonna end well - that how it'll go down.
been reading everyone's comments on this thread and enjoying their theories about the storyline and their strong emotions towards the characters......I wonder how many threads like this there are in Japanese....

in any case, if it does go down the way joeboygo wrote, or similar to it, I think you should go to Odaiba and demand a writer's job! ha ha.....

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Post by richnrich » Jun 21st, '07, 16:43

i'm a bit scared to watch the ending (i'm a pro ken-rei ending...i dun really care about tada :glare: )....there are so many possibilities...and if you see the preview of eps.11
when ken is crying, he is not wearing the tux...it seems he is wearing the same suit that he wears during rei-tada's wedding reception (in the present time)....
Image

could it be that he is crying because he realizes nothing has changed after he returns to the present? it would be better if the slideshow were shown before the wedding vow so that ken would still have time to fix things after he comes back to the present.... :-(

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