[Discussion] Zeni Geba - Matsuyama Kenichi

Discuss Japanese drama series here.
hey9
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[Discussion] Zeni Geba - Matsuyama Kenichi

Post by hey9 » Jan 29th, '09, 00:26

Image

Wiki: http://wiki.d-addicts.com/Zeni_Geba

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I'm surprised no one's made a thread about this show yet, it's so friggin good! Reminds me a lot of Maou. Matsuyama Kenichi is great as the money-grubbing but somewhat sympathetic Futarou (and hot...).

First episode was a lot of flashbacks and pretty grim. Second episode was ace...so badass muahahahaha.

ZoddGuts
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Post by ZoddGuts » Jan 29th, '09, 00:42

Yeah it's a great show easily my favorite this season. Hope he achives he's goals.

Anibas
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Post by Anibas » Jan 29th, '09, 02:36

I agree it's a really great show thus far, the plot is intriguing and I absolutely love MatsuKen's portrayal of Futarou.

I thought the first episode was good, and I loved the second episode, especially the scene where:
Futarou openly (well sort of) tells Akane how he thinks she's repulsive and bluntly tells her his plan to overtake her fathers company. All the while with a sweetly sinister smile on his face. Sheer awesomeness.
I can't wait for episode three.
I wonder what type of role the housekeeper Haruko will play, she knows he's not as sincere as he seems...

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Jan 29th, '09, 04:10

Thank you for making a topic on this show! I thought I was the only one watching it. What I like, and what I think may be turning some people off is the fact that this is a darker drama. Even the main character isn't a hero. He's not someone you want to root for, and honestly I'm not. Childhood aside, he's not a very nice person. Even some of the other characters are not what you would think of as "good guys". Which I actually really love.


Some spoiler-y thoughts:

I have a feeling housekeeper Haruko is as good as dead. She clearly knows that Futarou is bad news. I can see her spying on him, Futarou noticing and getting rid of her. Maybe making it look like she ran away or was called away.

Does Akane bother anyone else? She just has too much pity for herself. I understand that the birthmark may be a bother, but she just a little rude and a bit spoiled at times. Almost like a child, which I suppose she is. It's just odd that people are so polite to her(and her sis and dad clearly love her), but she just seems to hate everyone. I could understand her feeling sorry for herself, a bit - her sister is beautiful and seems to be popular with the men, as well as more educated - but, it's just a bit much right now. I mean - who asks their family to hire some man to be a friend? Then, threatens to kill herself if she doesn't get what she wants. I'm hoping for more on Akana.

Midori seems a bit interesting. I honestly thought Futarou was going to go after her at first, simply because of their past and because Mimura is billed second on the cast list. I wonder if she's truly as kind and gentle as she appears? I'd like to think so, but I also think she speaks before she thinks- like about the scar, when she was a ki. She reminds me of those people that tries really hard to not let their bad points show. I get the feeling that since Akana is basically a shut-in, it's been Midori whose always had to be the glowing daughter and the success story.


I wonder, and this is purely me thinking, if Futarou will marry Akana? She did say she wanted to marry him in the episode three preview. He does marry a daughter in the manga, though I'm not sure which one (and I think there's only one in the manga). I also wonder: will he marry Akana, but develop feelings for Midori? He seemed to like her when they were kids. And perhaps him having feelings for someone will make him more likeable? Of course, I think the folks at the restaurant are the ones that will make his character more human to those watching.

I also have a feeling Futarou will die at the end - taking a couple of people with him.

celticmoon
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Post by celticmoon » Jan 29th, '09, 08:33

This drama is really good, and seems like it can only get more exciting as it progresses. Somehow I have a feeling that few of the characters will remain alive by the end though...

Baruchan
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Post by Baruchan » Jan 29th, '09, 12:26

This is definitely one of the dramas I'm enjoying the most this season. I like how almost none of the characters is totally likeable/dislikeable (I don't know why, but Midori's got something that quite puts me off, too), and Matsuyama Ken'ichi's acting is downright awesome, especially when
in episode 2 he points at the huge ship and laughs calling it a pile of money, it was crazy.
I'm also looking forward to the role Futarou's father plays in the game,
since he found Mikuni's mansion and all.

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Jan 29th, '09, 13:04

Re Futarou in ep 2:

Yeah, that was creepy. With him rolling around on the ground and all that. He really is slightly insane, isn't he? Must be because he murdered someone and because of the death of his mom.


Re Midori: I agree, she's almost too nice and trusting. Like I said

I think she tries very hard to hide the unlikeable things about herself. Such as when she thought Futarou took the watch, but she tried not to say anything. I also think she's a bit thoughtless in some things: thinking Futarou could leave work at anytime, etc. I don't think she's "evil", I just think she's hiding and repressing a lot of who she really is, something which may come back to bite her in the butt.

Re: Futarou's Dad:
He could try to blackmail Futarou? I have a feeling people are going to start dropping dead next week. Maybe he'll be the first? Him or the housekeeper.[ According to the manga, Futarou also kills the girl's dad in order to take over the company

colyn7
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Post by colyn7 » Jan 29th, '09, 13:10

hmmm.. interesting.. I might watch this.. is this already available at any streaming sites?

colyn7
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Post by colyn7 » Jan 29th, '09, 13:12

I found it.. Ya ta!!! am gonna watch this..

Baruchan
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Post by Baruchan » Jan 29th, '09, 14:30

Re: Re: Futarou's Dad
I also thought about blackmail at first, but then wondered about what actual blackmail he holds over Futarou that Midori is not aware of yet. From what it looks like, the last glimpse Futarou had of him was when he gave him that scar, unless something happened after he ran away from the orphanage we haven't yet been informed of.
But I agree with you on the death part, he might be killed soon, though I wouldn't be so sure for the Haruko girl.
I love how this drama is making me think of all the possible intricate developments :cheers:

Sapporo Girl
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Post by Sapporo Girl » Jan 29th, '09, 14:45

MatsuKen is rock solid!!!

Futarou's Dad
He's probably not going to die anytime soon. The lead and two co-stars are color coded. He's GREEN, third in the cast (although on Fuji, he might actually be second). WifeBeaterChildAbuser might bite it in episode 08 or 09, however it would be REALLY interesting if they killed him before then. Not that I care. All I need is Tea Bag...er...um... Futarou.
@Hey9

Thanks for creating this thread. This *is* the drama of the season. I was planning to skip all of them, but I can't resist Futarou's bad-@ssness!!!

Anibas
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Post by Anibas » Jan 29th, '09, 16:57

Here are my thoughts on Midori what will happen to Futarou's father and the housekeeper Haruko:
First, I agree with Sapporo Girl I don't think Futarou's dad will be killed off, at least not any time soon. He plays to big a role in Futarou's life to be killed. I think it's interesting to note that he wasn't always the monster that he is now. I wonder if we'll see in other flashbacks what it was that triggered him to change.

Haruko, I think shell be dead soon. She's to much of a liability to Futatou in achieving his ultimate goal, and I think he'll wise up to her. She'll need to go. However, if she does in fact live I think she may be the one to eventually out Futarou to Detective Ogino about one of his misdeeds that he will inevitably commit.

I don't know about Midori. I think she behaves the way she does because she may feel guilty about how she treated Futarou when she was a kid. Now she wants to, I guess, treat him better especially now that he's becoming closer to Akane. She can't help but keep treating him kindly, but I feel she is a bit hypocritical because it seems she still has reservations about him.
I'm not sure if anyone else was curious about this but:
Does anyone else want to know more about Kaori's older brother? She showed Futarou his picture saying there is a resemblance between him and Futarou. She also told him that he was a delinquent and that she hadn't seen him in a while. Maybe that'll be brought up again in a future episode.

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Jan 29th, '09, 21:46

I have some thoughts about the housekeeper:

I agree about Haruko. She will either die soon, mor (and I think this is it -) she'll be the slient observer(sp?) She'll watch what is happening in the house and will be the one to expose all of the wrong doings.

Re Midori:

I agree. I think her kindness is to make up for certain things in her past. I think she feels bad for what happened when they were children. As well as Akane - while she does seem to try and get Akane out and about, it's fairly clear that Midori has failed in getting close to her sister.


Look at the party: Futarou's POV showed Midori in this light, smiling at everyone, but more or less ignoring the fact that Akane was clearly uncomfortable and uneasy. While she tries to help get her sister out of her shell, it's clear Midori can't. That must make her feel horrible, which is most likely one of the reasons she's being so nice to Futarou - to try and make up for everything.


Re: Kaori's older brother

I don't think they would have mentioned it if it weren't going to come back around. I think the brother might come back into play sooner or later.
[/spoiler]

hey9
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Post by hey9 » Jan 29th, '09, 23:32

Futarou does seem to do an unnatural amount of rolling around the ground lol...weird
I definitely think the maid is gonna die. Midori is a little irritating. I'm kind of hoping Akane and Futarou team up and enact some havoc together.

It's kind of weird how dark the whole show is, except for the scenes with the Nonomura family. I'm wondering too what's up with that girl's older brother.

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Jan 29th, '09, 23:43

hey9 wrote:Futarou does seem to do an unnatural amount of rolling around the ground lol...weird
I definitely think the maid is gonna die. Midori is a little irritating. I'm kind of hoping Akane and Futarou team up and enact some havoc together.

It's kind of weird how dark the whole show is, except for the scenes with the Nonomura family. I'm wondering too what's up with that girl's older brother.

:lol Futarou's laughing and rolling on the ground and money is something that freaks me out. He really is :goggle: .

The scenes at the Nonomura place make me laugh. They almost don't fit in with the rest of the drama. But, I think they are a way to let the viewer see a softer side of Futarou.

I don't think Futarou and Akane will team up - he seems to hate her and be disgusted simply by the sight of her. Makes me wonder what he'll do if he marries her. :| And to be honest, I hope they don't team up. Akane, as I've said is irritating, at least to me. However, I do think Futarou will try and play her for as long as he can.

kawaiimomo
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Post by kawaiimomo » Jan 30th, '09, 00:06

my god I LOVE this show!!! definitely the best of the season though i guess i can't say that yet until i finish triangle which is also great! anyways i agree with what everyone says about the maid. she' probably gonna get killed off sooner or later. and i absolutely adore Matsuken here! he's so evil and crazy! and i'm a sucker for a hot psychopathic guy! :wub: can't help it! :lol and i like the Futaro and Akane pairing! too bad he doesn't see her that way :-( o well can't wait for ep 3!

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Jan 31st, '09, 21:35

Episode three is out for BT. I'm bt'ing it now - just two more hours. :) And just six episodes after this one.

Seems like this is the epiisode in which Akane tells her father and sister that she wants to/will marry Futaro. As much as she annoys me, I do hope Akane wakes up and smells the coffee - He's using you, honey! You know, it says a lot about Akane's life, the way she fell for Futaro just because he was a little nice to her. I mean, it seems that aside from her family and housekeeper no one is kind to her or they simply ignore her in favor of Midori.

Sapporo Girl
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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 1st, '09, 03:12

I don't think Futarou is as apathetic towards Akane as he pretends to be. Sometimes, people who are <i>generally</i> good and decent...deep deep inside, need to talk themselves into batshizz insane-ness. He kills me every time he covers up Akane's ears to be nasty. I don't know why, but those scenes make MatsuKen ultra sizzling hot!!! Those brown pants really fit him well...

Yeah, I don't need the frakking plot when MatsuKen and his big hands, big feet and pretty thumb-sucker's lips are on screen.
About what he buried... as much as I'd love for it to be that Dull Rich Boy, I can't believe Futarou would be so stupid. If he was, surely Daddy, will take care of business because his Hot son's future is his future, too. I suspect Futarou has buried his "old" life. Don't get me wrong. I have no use for Dull Rich Boy. I'm fine with him being the road kill of the week. Before long, I guess Futarou will be burying the maid. Maybe she ought to mind her own business. Too bad Midori's actress is blue in color. I'd like to see the end of her, too.

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 1st, '09, 04:07

Sapporo Girl wrote:I don't think Futarou is as apathetic towards Akane as he pretends to be.

About what he buried... as much as I'd love for it to be that Dull Rich Boy, I can't believe Futarou would be so stupid. If he was, surely Daddy, will take care of business because his Hot son's future is his future, too. I suspect Futarou has buried his "old" life. Don't get me wrong. I have no use for Dull Rich Boy. I'm fine with him being the road kill of the week. Before long, I guess Futarou will be burying the maid. Maybe she ought to mind her own business. Too bad Midori's actress is blue in color. I'd like to see the end of her, too.

I agree with you on Futaro and Akane. Yes, he is using her. However, I do think he feels a bit sorry for her. I believe he sees a little bit of himself in her.

As for Futaro killing Dull Rich Boy, I think we are meant to think he did it. But, I must confess I agree that it would be a bad move. The girls' father already doesn't trust him. I do have a feeling that at this point, someone will die or be seriously hurt every episode.

As for some other thoughts on the episode:


- Akane's jealously toward the F/M interaction spoke volumes to me. It's fairly clear she plays second fiddle to her older sister, and the idea of Futaro liking Midori more was killing her. No wonder she suddenly said she was going to marry Futaro.

- Speaking of that, why is Futaro cozying up to both sisters now? He has Akane. Why try and make Midori like him more than she already does?

- Futaro paying that guy/letting that guy get away was pure genius! He proved he's "loyal" to the sisters and got both their respect. Too bad Midori's friend has his number - if he's still alive. (I think he is dead, just not in that bag. I say that because I believe the actor is only credited for episodes two and three)


- Haruko (the housekeeper) better watch herself. Futaro is starting to see something's up. But, she really should get Mr. Mikuni alone and tell him that she has an uneasy feeling and of what she saw in the hallway.

- The scenes at the Nonomura family's place were actually really nice. I loved that Futaro sort of smiled and nearly laughed at their bickering.

- Futaro's scenes with his father were chilling.

Sapporo Girl
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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 1st, '09, 04:59

I'm pretty sure I agree with you on all fronts. I absolutely love this show. It's pulling me in many directions emotionally.
nikkibell84 wrote: I agree with you on Futaro and Akane. Yes, he is using her. However, I do think he feels a bit sorry for her. I believe he sees a little bit of himself in her.
This is normal since, under other circumstances, he'd be a nice guy rather than a confirmed hot psychotic double murderer. Akane is devoted to him. Regardless of where her feelings stem, what she feels for him is pure and he can't help but react to that. He's still human... more or less.

I'll try write within your spoiler space. Let's see if the colors work.
As for Futaro killing Dull Rich Boy, I think we are meant to think he did it.

***Although he's sure to be dead or gone, I'd have issues with Dull Rich Boy if he couldn't escape a guy who could barely walk.
I do have a feeling that at this point, someone will die or be seriously hurt every episode.

***I, too, have visions of the Road Kill of the Week.
- Akane's jealously toward the F/M interaction spoke volumes to me. It's fairly clear she plays second fiddle to her older sister, and the idea of Futaro liking Midori more was killing her. No wonder she suddenly said she was going to marry Futaro.

***I agree. It also must have hurt that Midori could move so fast and get to him. It made Akane's situation seem all the more pitiful. All of her physical limitations were suddenly thrust into her face in the worst way. Futarou though played it like a pro. While he was being cordial and kind to Midori, he did make his "affections" clear to Akane when he did approach her.

- Speaking of that, why is Futaro cozying up to both sisters now? He has Akane. Why try and make Midori like him more than she already does?

***Maybe he wasn't making a real play for her. He's already figured out that Midori is out of his league. Then again, she's looking at him with fawning affection now that he has "saved" her, thus, the plot might thicken and this might ultimately be his undoing.

Too bad Midori's friend has his number - if he's still alive. (I think he is dead, just not in that bag. I say that because I believe the actor is only credited for episodes two and three)

***Given that Futarou showed his true self to that guy, plus he made a confession, the guy must be dead, just not in the bag.

- Haruko (the housekeeper) better watch herself.

***I have no use for her. Bye Haruko! I think she was reluctant to talk to Mr. Mikuni because as a family they don't treat her like she's one of them. Perhaps she's too young for that honor.

- The scenes at the Nonomura family's place were actually really nice. I loved that Futaro sort of smiled and nearly laughed at their bickering.

***I absolutely love those crazy people. I can't help but wonder if Futarou will somehow set up the long-lost delinquent brother in the end. Thus, that guy can take the fall and Futarou can run off with the goods. The two of them favor and the brother has been mentioned twice.

- Futaro's scenes with his father were chilling.

***I loved when they met last week. Matsuken's portrayal of Futarou's confusion, anger and fear were mind boggling. He's as big as that, but every time WifeBeater appears, he's reduced to a small hurt child. I wish he'd actually killed that sap. I'm glad the cop knows WifeBeater isn't exactly a good role model.
I love this drama. I wish I didn't have to work!

hey9
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Post by hey9 » Feb 3rd, '09, 04:17

Midori...ugh!
Can't stand that girl. I can see where Akane is coming from. Perfect people disgust me too lol.

Can anyone tell me what happened with the Nonomura family? Futarou was starting to act all friendly with them and then the music changed and he looked angry again, what was up with that? The family cracks me up, though, hope nothing bad happens to them XO
One thing that I've found different in this jdrama than any I've watched is the protaganist does actually seem utterly irredeemable. I think I'd be kind of disappointed if he did redeem himself. I like most of the characters except for Midori and dull rich guy. The father and detective are really interesting too. The detective should be the "hero" of the story, but comes off as very unlikeable, too.

Lifo
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Post by Lifo » Feb 3rd, '09, 18:41

I love such story lines, they attract me.

TabooxNightmare
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Post by TabooxNightmare » Feb 3rd, '09, 21:46

I love this story because it's something out of the ordinary - it has something very relieving to like the "bad guy", and I kind of hope whatever goal Futarou reaches, may it be the fulfillment of his plan or a change of heart, I hope it stays as eerily believable as the rest of this drama so far.

colyn7
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Post by colyn7 » Feb 4th, '09, 21:34

I hope he get to change his heart.. As what his mother said "Money is not that matters, its a person's heart."

hayz.. am not liking his roLe in here as a bad guy.. -.-

Machihxh
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Post by Machihxh » Feb 5th, '09, 10:15

hey9 wrote:
Can anyone tell me what happened with the Nonomura family? Futarou was starting to act all friendly with them and then the music changed and he looked angry again, what was up with that? The family cracks me up, though, hope nothing bad happens to them XO
@ hey9: [spoiler]Well when the "delinquent" missing son's dad Nonomura Yasuhiko was sitting down having a conversation with Futaro, he told him how he has a son, the one who looks just like him and how he doesn't know where or what he is doing, but probably up to no good anyways. But he doesn't care about all that, as long as he stays alive and how he can do all the bad he wants, just as long as he doesn't kill anyone.(That's when the music started to change as Futaro's facial expression changed) Also, after that everyone started to have a closer look at Futaro and Nonomura Shoko(the wife) told him how he really looks like their son, if he didn't have the scar near his eye. I hope that helped :-) [/spoiler]

chokubi
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Post by chokubi » Feb 5th, '09, 19:16

I just love how this drama brings out the evilness in me, and feeling good about it. 8)
Funny thing is the way how Matsuyama Kenichi (awesomely) pulls this off, which doesn't make this drama seem gloomy or dark at all, in my opinion at least.
Maybe it's the script, I don't know. But I'm enjoying it a lot 'cos of all that. :mrgreen:

Sapporo Girl
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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 6th, '09, 05:02

Whatever you do, do NOT watch the trailers for the upcoming week's episodes especially version B, on Zeni Geba's official site! Spoilers are abound! Matsuken is frakking amazing!!!

Hot-n-Sinister Futarou is evil love!!!

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 7th, '09, 00:35

Ah. Now I want to go watch the trailers. I'm really enjoying this show, and so I want to know what's coming up. I must not go to the site. . . who am I kidding? I'm going in a moment.


edit: sadly, I couldn't find the promos. :(

Sapporo Girl
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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 7th, '09, 04:18

When you're on the site, look for the letters A and B. When they appear, click on B. These are the forthcoming episode's trailers. There is only one major and one minor spoiler that you can see visually. :w00t: While I knew it was coming, for whatever reason, I just didn't expect it to happen so soon...which is silly because this drama only has nine episodes. Matsuken...I'm so glad he's back on television!!! 8 hours, more or less to go! Whew!
nikkibell84 wrote:Ah. Now I want to go watch the trailers. I'm really enjoying this show, and so I want to know what's coming up. I must not go to the site. . . who am I kidding? I'm going in a moment.


edit: sadly, I couldn't find the promos. :(

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 7th, '09, 04:53

Sapporo Girl wrote:When you're on the site, look for the letters A and B. When they appear, click on B. These are the forthcoming episode's trailers. There is only one major and one minor spoiler that you can see visually. :w00t: While I knew it was coming, for whatever reason, I just didn't expect it to happen so soon...which is silly because this drama only has nine episodes. Matsuken...I'm so glad he's back on television!!! 8 hours, more or less to go! Whew!

Yes, I found those. But, it just brought me to a white page with some writing in japanese. I'm guessing I don't have what is needed to view the videos.
Was the big spoiler the death of the housekeeper? Or the father? Because, I think that nearly everyone will be killed at some point. I think at least six or seven more people can be killed within the next six episodes.
Has anyone else watched episode three with subs? Now that I can read what is being said, I do understand it a bit more. Futaro is rather sly, isn't he? He really does know how to play with people.
[/spoiler]

ZoddGuts
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Post by ZoddGuts » Feb 7th, '09, 06:38

Assuming he got rid of the rich boy which I think he did considering he would have no choice because Futaro told him the truth about himself, I would guess the next person to go will be the housemaid followed by he's father then maybe the cop towards the end.

All people that get in he's way must be ridden off mwhuhuhuhua! :D

nikkibell84
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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 7th, '09, 06:56

I've actually been thinking about it, and here is what I think

Haruko (the housekeeper) will be killed by Futaro within the next two episodes. He'll make it look like she left on her own.

Kenzo (Futaro's dad) will be killed toward the end of the series. Somewhere between episodes seven and nine.

According to the four volume manga from the 70s, Mr. Mikuni will be killed by Futaro at some point. I'm guessing Futaro will make it look like a heart attack or accident of some kind.


Sugeta Jun (the junior detective) will be killed. Maybe by accident or on purpose. This will twist the knife Ogino Satoshi (the older detective) has in his heart and move him forward in his wait to take down Futaro. First his brother, than his partner? No way he'd let that slide.

I can't see any of the restaruant folks being killed.
Akane and Midori are also tricky.
We know Futaro sees Akane's "role" as being over once he marries her. But, does he really have it in him to kill this girl, who worships the ground he walks on? Yes, he says he's disgusted by her, but. . . I don't know if he could actually kill her. I also don't think it would be wise. A better way would be for Futaro to have someone attack him when it's just Akane. Akane tries to help, but being slow, is caught in the middle of it and killed.

As for Midori, at this point it is in Futaro's best interest to keep her alive. For one, she's on his side in regard to Akane and secondly, he knows how to get important information out of her - I'm refering to him questioning her about Rich Boy during epsode four. I can't see Futaro killing her either, but who knows. I can see her dying, though. Maybe being killed while trying to protect Akane or even Futaro?

As for Futaro and Ogino Satoshi -



It's a little cliche, but I do think one has to kill the other. I don't think they'll both die, but one of them seems to have to die.

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Post by Machihxh » Feb 7th, '09, 12:56

Sapporo Girl wrote:When you're on the site, look for the letters A and B. When they appear, click on B. These are the forthcoming episode's trailers. There is only one major and one minor spoiler that you can see visually. :w00t: While I knew it was coming, for whatever reason, I just didn't expect it to happen so soon...which is silly because this drama only has nine episodes. Matsuken...I'm so glad he's back on television!!! 8 hours, more or less to go! Whew!
nikkibell84 wrote:Ah. Now I want to go watch the trailers. I'm really enjoying this show, and so I want to know what's coming up. I must not go to the site. . . who am I kidding? I'm going in a moment.


edit: sadly, I couldn't find the promos. :(
I went to the official site as well and tried to have a little peek at the trailers. I clicked on both A & B and it took me to a blank white page. Maybe they removed the trailers or could it be that you can only view it if you are in Japan?

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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 7th, '09, 15:21

Sorry everyone. It's quite possible the trailers are only viewable in Japan. I get that a lot in the reverse. It's quite frustrating.

As for episode 4... well, I know I shouldn't wish for anyone's death, real or imagined, but Hot-n-Sinister's father needs to die.right.now! Futarou is clearly sick. His father is evil!!! I also know I shouldn't wish Futarou well...but...where this particular nutjob is concerned, I want the best for him, if only for a short time. Granted, he needs to bite it at the end, but for the time being... gambatte Futarou!! I just don't want him to hurt Akane. too badly. Sadly, I still can't conjure up any sympathy or affection for the detective. I wish I could, but I can't.

Spoilers for episode 4:
I can't believe Futarou buried Dull Rich Boy in the backyard. That he did. How dumb was that? Of course, if it hadn't been for that maid... Anyway, he's officially a triple murderer now.Not to worry. SuperiorEvilWifeBeater saved the day, but it's clear that Futarou won't benefit from his father's intervention at all. It must be tough having Satan for a Dad.

A lot of stuff happened in this episode, including the return of the missing delinquent. I'll have to watch again to get a sense of timing, but I'd hate to think that Futarou killed him too, given that he's on an murder-per-episode spree. Haruko-chan has lived an episode too long for my taste. Unfortunately, she isn't the one on the chopping block for episode 5.
I love this show!!!!

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 7th, '09, 18:46

[quote="Sapporo Girl"]
Spoilers for episode 4:
I can't believe Futarou buried Dull Rich Boy in the backyard. That he did. How dumb was that? Of course, if it hadn't been for that maid... Anyway, he's officially a triple murderer now.Not to worry. SuperiorEvilWifeBeater saved the day, but it's clear that Futarou won't benefit from his father's intervention at all. It must be tough having Satan for a Dad.

A lot of stuff happened in this episode, including the return of the missing delinquent. I'll have to watch again to get a sense of timing, but I'd hate to think that Futarou killed him too, given that he's on an murder-per-episode spree. Haruko-chan has lived an episode too long for my taste. Unfortunately, she isn't the one on the chopping block for episode 5.
/quote]



Whoa, wait. . .
He buried Dull Rich Boy in the backyard. Futaro! I thought he had more sense then that. He must have been in a rush.

I agree about what Evil!Dad did, he's so wants something in return.


Haruko-chan. . . I'm starting to think that she'll
be Futaro's downfall. She is gaining way to much information about Futaro's shady dealings. Who looks to be the death of the episode next week? Mmm. . .Futaro's not going to have much time to help plan the wedding if he keeps killing people like this.


In a way, I am feeling more and more sorry toward Futaro. He's mentally ill, and most likely has been since he
killed that man.He was, what nine or ten? That would mess up anybody. And, he was already conviced that his mother died because they had no money (which is partly true).
Futaro doesn't need money, he needs help.

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Post by Anibas » Feb 8th, '09, 01:05

Just watch episode three and I have to say I feel really bad for Akane.
She genuinely loves Futarou, and to see him tell her in her face that her "role" will be over soon is just so cruel, yet still wicked awesome.
Ugh, but as much as I want to hate Futarou, strangely, I really can't help but to want to see him achieve his goal...

Oh, and I also agree about
Futarou not dumping the body of rich guy in the backyard. I'm not sure what he could have buried but from the way he was desperately washing himself after it all, it must have been something major. I really hope it wasn't the body of the rich guy, but if it was it will mean the unavailing of Futarou's true self if, or rather when, it's discovered.
I'm still don't think that Haruko (the housekeeper) will be killed off anytime soon. I believe that she will play the silent observer as nikkibell84 suggested.
She tried to speak up about Futarou, but I think that since is just a housekeeper and since Akane and Midori do feel he is genuine that made her hesitate about saying anything. She probably feels that they wouldn't believe her and (would possibly fire her) for speaking badly about him. She may try just keep quiet and continue to watch Futarou and get some kind of proof that he isn't as kind as he's pretending to be. And now with the jacket... maybe she has her proof.

OR, maybe Futarou is already suspecting her and is setting her up to fired. He purposefully placed the dirty jacket on the table so that she'll be curious and somehow she'll stumble upon the hole he dug, lead Mr. Mikuni and the others to the hole to be dug up and eventually find nothing incriminating in it and they will subsequently fire her.
I'm probably looking way too into this though, lol, I like these types of shows that leave me speculating like this.

Also, the Nonomura family was hilarious in episode three. The restaurant owners younger sister cracks me up.

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Post by Machihxh » Feb 8th, '09, 04:08

I just finished watching the 4th episode and [spoiler]I agree, I can't believe Futaro actually buried his body there. Out of all the places, he chose the area near their house. :crazy: At the end of the 4th episode it showed Futaro's evil dad with some lady. That lady wasn't Haruko was it? I' also agree that Futaro's dad definitely wants something in return. Probably $$ or he wants in on whatever Futaro's working on. I can't wait to see next week's episode. In the previews for it, it seems like Midori figured out Futaro's true demeanor somehow, as she was warning Akane of Futaro. :-( I wonder if Haruko told her or if she figured it out herself. Even though Futaro committed all those murder's and probably more to come, I still want him to live in the end. :unsure: [/spoiler]

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 8th, '09, 20:07

I skimmed episode four last night, and I have some thoughts and ideas about what's to come:


For ep. 5
I believe that is the ep where Futaro kills Mr. M, making it look like a heart attack. He may even give him something that would give the old man a stroke. At least that would get him out of the way.


The scene where Midori was crying and trying to speak to Akane - I think that will be when she tells her sister something happened to their father. I do wonder if the wedding will be postponed or if they will have already married? Mm.


But, I do agree - if Akane dies right after Mr. M - Midori would be stupid not to piece some things together. In my mind, she should already be piecing a thing or two together. And so should Akane. But, I guess they are too far gone in Futaro's charm and understanding to notice. It's a bit like those people in abusive relationships, who say'No, he/she loves me. It's okay.'

Some thoughts on ep 4:
As awful as what Futaro is doing is - he knows how to work those girls. Going back to his work and pretending he'd give up on Akane. He must have known full well that Akane would be depressed and that Midori would come ask him to come back. If he didn't plan it that way, he must have been surprised. But, I do think Futaro had, at least an idea, that it would work out for him.

The brother finally arrives! He's very cute, too. :-) I have a feeling Futaro will end up using him somehow.

What could happen:
So, Futaro kills everyone he's going to kill: the fathers, maybe a daughter or two, a housekeeper, maybe a cop. He then takes the brother, gives him the same scar, cuts his hair, and kills him: cops think it's Futaro. Futaro rides off into the sunset with his one true love: money. He sends back a few thousand to the Nonomura family (because their business is poor and because he actually likes them, so he feels a bit bad). The Nonomura family just assumes that the no good brother left again, and that the money is from someone. Maybe they know, maybe they don't. Maybe Futaro gives it under the brother's name, saying the brother has gone overseas. Maybe he takes Midori's advice and fixes the scar, so he can go back and visit the Nonomura family as the brother - whose changed and has a good job - from time to time.

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Post by goygakgoy » Feb 10th, '09, 04:06

Thisis a really great drama. L is easily one of the best actors in m opinion.

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Post by kisnyulacska » Feb 10th, '09, 11:44

Excellent drama. Don't know how I was able to fail to notice Matsuyama Kenichi until watching Zeni Geba.
The screenwriters try to squeeze a little bit too much story into the episodes, though, don't they? Not that it really bothers me - the resulting inconsistencies somehow add to the enjoyment.

Dull Rich Boy for example (spoilers for ep 3)
What it boils down to: In a park full of people Pretty Healthy Looking Dull Rich Boy is annihilated by Somewhat Disabled One Leg Futarou without anybody noticing. A large bag and a suitcase to put the body into appear out of nowhere; It's not like he could have moved the body without a suitcase and leave a dead body lying around in broad daylight - not my idea of a clever maneuver.
Let's be honest: The only reason why we didn't see Futarou in Berserk Mode with Dull Rich Boy is that nobody was able to come up with a plausible course of events.
Or Futarou's intelligence (spoilers for ep 4)
Did anyone notice how there's a drastical reduction of Futarou's brainpower when it comes to dead bodies? As long as he's dealing with the Mikuni Family he's quite the psychological mastermind, analyzing and manipulating them with ease. But O beware, Futarou, of Corpses! They turn his brain into mere decoration:
The body of Desperate Factory Worker? Oh, let's just leave him on the ground as is. The police will clean him up, no problem.
Dull Rich Boy? Backyard of the Mikuni mansion, no doubt. And don't forget to bury his cell phone with him! Switched on, of course. Let's hope the battery will last until somebody hears it ringing.
And am I the only one wondering about Futarou's acting skills? (spoilers for ep 4)
Not MatsuKen's, of course. They're beyond discussion. But Futarou is quite the actor himself, isn't he? Fooling the two daughters and the father with well-thought-out words as well as honest facial expressions. To an extent that needs intelligence, a talent for improvisation, foresight and a cool head.
Funny then how his mask crumbles as soon as the door closes behind the Mikuni Family. He should be sort of aware of the fact that there are housemaids and other people walking about the house. And what's with that expression while they're trying to dig up Dull Rich Boy? Why make obvious confessions before anybody even knows what's going on? Why make a face as if the thought of somebody noticing that funny looking spot in the backyard with a ringing cell phone beneath had never ever occured to him?
Beats me.

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Post by lzydata » Feb 10th, '09, 14:33

Heh, everything you said. It might have been more believable if, for instance, they met back on the Rich Boy's boat and in some tussle he fell overboard. But obviously they're really pushing the "I'll do anything for money" tagline very hard. And then there are the strange interludes with the Nonomuras. When the lookalike good-for-nothing actually appeared I groaned. Now they've done it. Has ZG jumped the shark?
Anyway, the biggest thing about Futaro that makes me think the guy's just whacko, beyond hope, is how he keeps going on about how his mother died because they had no money therefore he hates being poor and he'll do anything to have more money. Fine, but now he does - somehow he's managed to earn (or steal) millions of yen and stash it in his house without getting robbed or suspected. As someone above said, when he looks at his fellow temp factory or shipyard workers he thinks, "I've won, you losers." He thinks of himself as rich compared to them! So he hates being poor, wants to be rich, is rich compared to most people he's around with, and yet he also hates rich people supposedly because of their airs.

Yeah, there's lots about Zeni Geba to dislike or just laugh at, but I still enjoy watching it :) Might be because it's so rare to have such a 99%, if not 100% evil protagonist whose motives and actions you won't condone in real life but whom people like Matsuyama Kenichi portray so frighteningly. It's really his show. (Although Shiina Kippei as the evil father is excellent too.)
Btw, the Dramanote blogger (in Japanese) pointed out something very important - who tipped off Ogino to the body? I simple-mindedly thought it was Haruko, but actually it makes even more sense that Kenzo did it himself. He's the one who knows who Ogino is, not Haruko! Which only makes the point that somehow Futaro has missed so painfully obvious: it's not "money" or "rich people" but his father that's screwed up his life all along. And now he's back to haunt him with that secret.

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Post by citrone » Feb 10th, '09, 14:46

I think everybody will be dead at the end of the show, including Futaro himself...

I don't get it but, so many corpse already and I can still laugh at the show. Maybe it is because the show is a little bit "light" and you couldn't take it seriously....

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Post by Herm » Feb 10th, '09, 17:21

I am no Japanese expert, but I think "Futaro" means "vagabond." Then you have Akane - which sounds pretty similar to "Okane" (money) and then you have Midori (green). Maybe just a coincidence but . . .

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 11th, '09, 05:02

About Futaro's brain going missing at certain times:

I had thought about that a bit throughout the episodes. When it's time to get the sisters to do what he wants, he has no problems. In fact, many times the girls seem to do more than he needed them to. BUT, when it's time to kill people, get rid of bodies, etc - the boy becomes an idiot. With Dull Rich Boy - he should have thrown him into the river/ocean; that would have made it seem like he had fallen off his boat. Or even - cut the body into pieces and spread/bury it around the place. But, for the love of money - don't bury it in the backyard with a cell phone! That was just dumb. I can understand why the writer(s) did it, but it was a dumb move from someone who seemed to have been planing out that murder. (We know Futaro was sniffing around Midori for info. To me, that said that Futaro was planning on getting rid of someone who doubted him.)

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Post by Kakijun » Feb 11th, '09, 05:33

Herm wrote:I am no Japanese expert, but I think "Futaro" means "vagabond." Then you have Akane - which sounds pretty similar to "Okane" (money) and then you have Midori (green). Maybe just a coincidence but . . .
Lol! I only ever thought about the first one. I think Midori is a coincidence though. I think JPN money isn't green.
How did Futaro manage to kill the rich boy anyway? That leg didn't seem that stable.
I loved Robo in this episode! So nice to see Kenichi using his 'other' acting personality.

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Post by kisnyulacska » Feb 11th, '09, 11:28

Talking about names: Let's not forget that Kenzo is very similar to kanzo (肝臓) which means liver, Satoshi (Oginos first name) can also mean admonition, guidance (諭し) and Joji (the father of Akane and Midori) is a homophone of love affair (情事) so I guess they still owe us an illegitimate child (to be honest I really don't think that the mangaka thought that much about the names. There's just a lot of homophony in Japanese. Makes it hard to avoid associations)

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 11th, '09, 23:31

The name thing may have just happened, but I still think it's pretty interesting. Names often give insight to characters. I remember reading somewhere that many times authors/script writers (wether they mean to or not) often give names that fit a part of a character.


Akane's name, to me, really doesn't seem like a coincidence, because of her role in Futaro's plan.

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Post by hafizadam » Feb 12th, '09, 00:18

Kakijun wrote:Lol! I only ever thought about the first one. I think Midori is a coincidence though. I think JPN money isn't green.
how about her face?
the birthmark is green right?
btw, does anyone notice that when Futarou made that "in front Akane's face" scene, she always replied "I want to listen/hear".. looks like that scene shows Futarous's mind or something, not the real act..

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 12th, '09, 20:47

Akane has the birthmark, not Midori. Akane's name sounding like money is a good play on the fact that Futaro is using her to get to the family business.

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Post by hafizadam » Feb 13th, '09, 02:07

oopss, get messed up with the name, haha lol :D

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The Maid

Post by Herm » Feb 13th, '09, 06:48

I wonder what will happen to the maid. . .
The other poster wrote that it was probably the father that tipped off the police - which makes sense. Because the caller asked for the detective by name. . . . the father got his B card last ep.

But the maid found the body and did not call the police? Why would she not call the police or tell someone about it?

So - if it was the father, he knows the location of the body and might try to blackmail Futaro...it would not surprise me if Futaro kills the father . . .
Can someone explain the rules when it comes to when we are supposed to use the "Spoiler" button? I don't know when something is supposed to be masked and when not . . .
Last edited by Herm on Feb 13th, '09, 07:19, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Herm » Feb 13th, '09, 06:57

kisnyulacska wrote:Talking about names: Let's not forget that Kenzo is very similar to kanzo (肝臓) which means liver, Satoshi (Oginos first name) can also mean admonition, guidance (諭し) and Joji (the father of Akane and Midori) is a homophone of love affair (情事) so I guess they still owe us an illegitimate child (to be honest I really don't think that the mangaka thought that much about the names. There's just a lot of homophony in Japanese. Makes it hard to avoid associations)
True. . . . but most writers think carefully about the names of the characters and the significance they may have. . . the names are deliberate choices, and the authors should be aware of any sound similarities with other words, since this is what they do for a living . . .

Of course the names could just be coincidences, but given the story there is at least good reason to think the case might be otherwise . . .

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Post by lucky_kiss » Feb 13th, '09, 13:57

I began watching the drama yesterday & I'm so curious about Futaro's charatcer.. Frankly he is a psycho when it comes to Money & these kind of people do anything to get it :glare:, well as a beginning it's a good drama & I'm curious how it'll develop till the ending that was the reason that attract me to watch it.. :-)

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Post by hey9 » Feb 14th, '09, 00:09

I saw a guy on the train today with a green birthmark on his cheek, my immediate thought was "Akane!" but he was also an old Native guy so the similarities ended there lol...

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Post by Herm » Feb 14th, '09, 12:55

Yeah I thought 5 was the worst episode by far. . . it just seems that they skipped over too much stuff . . .

OK. Akane is nuts...but she is loyal. You have to give her that.

I was kind of rooting for the guy before now. I thought that there was some chance he had an ounce of good left in him . . .

But I guess not.

I wonder what his downfall will be . . . maybe the older sister will snap out of it and kill him?

I wonder if he will kill the maid or find some way to use her. Killing her seems too easy . . .[/spoiler]

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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 14th, '09, 14:34

I, too, was more than a bit deflated by the episode 05. It didn't really have anything to do with redeeming Futarou though. He was certifiable back in episode 01, so that doesn't particularly bother me. He's insane and either needs to be locked away or have a bullet put in his head.

I think my reaction has more to do with a loss of lingering innocence. Up until now, it felt fun despite Futarou's heinous crimes, however, in this episode I felt was if I was suddenly thrust head first into Futarou's psychosis and now it's starting to hurt. The present situation is just sad. Perhaps it has to do with Futarou potentially losing one thread of sanity (when she picked up that ichi-man yen and saw him like that, it was physically painful)...

Had it been any other drama, I might have had a WTF moment with Akane's sudden change in behavior, but I couldn't muster the strength. The same with SatanDaddy's revelation. He's truly vile. Just vile.

All in all, the set up of this episode might have been a necessary evil. It is about time we truly got to the heart of the matter, isn't it?

Matsuken is still the man. I think Futarou is wearing him down a bit, but he's managing to hold it together and I know he'll finished strong.

Despite this quasi-letdown, I'm anxiously awaiting next week's episode.

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 15th, '09, 02:21

I agree that episode felt a bit rushed. But, I do understand why they may have felt the need to rush. There are only four episodes left and the manga (source material) was only four volumes long. There is only so much story to tell, as well. After all, the main character is steadily going more and more insane and becoming more unlikeable with each episode. I was rooting for Futaro at first, but at this point, while I find him interesting, I do think he just needs major help.


Some Thoughts On Episode Five/Episode Six Preview:
- I wish they had shown the wedding or even the afterward. Are Futaro and Akane even sleeping in the same room?

- Futaro really has Akane under his thumb, doesn't he? He tells her to jump and she asks how high.

-Did Futaro really have to kill Mr. M? The man seemed to be warming up to Futaro, somewhat. I'm not sure about what was said in episode five, but it looked that way in episode four.

- The restaurant family are some of the nicest and most honest people in the world, and I adore them.

-I'm so glad Midori work up and grew a brain. Finally she pieced everything together. Too bad Akane's done lost her mind!

-Akane drugging Midori is just scary. I always thought Akane was a little too obsessed with Futaro, but to drug her own sister!

-Futaro throwing the money off the roof and laughing/crying was just chilling.

The episode may have been a bit blah, but it was full of awesome little moments and character development.


As for the preview:

- What are Futaro and Akane saying to poor Midori?
- The housemaid is so dead.
- Is Futaro trying to pay off his dad?
-Is Futaro starting to fall apart, I mean even more than before? At least he's crying. I do think things are starting to get too heavy for him. I don't think he planned this far.

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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 15th, '09, 04:15

I peeped at the episode again during breakfast and I realized just how much we fans presume that Futarou is controlling Akane. Let me back up a bit. We're all presuming that Akane is a hapless little victim and she's somehow Futarou's pawn. This goes to show how much we've forgotten the type of person Akane was just five episodes ago.

Yes, she wants to please him and yes, she wants his love. The thing is, she's getting what she *wants* in very much the same way Futarou is getting what he thinks he needs to survive. Midori and her father wanted Akane's love and to be in her good graces. Futarou was a path to getting them what they wanted, too. Everyone should have been content. Unfortunately, Futarou's suffering continues and things became worse than they ever were before.

I feel great PITY for Futarou. He's absolutely pathetic and he's going to lose this game. They all say that the writer wrote this "long before his time" and I suppose he knew there would be a reckoning one day and he's using Futarou to demonstrate what happens when we lose sight of what is truly important. He can't beat the bucks. He can't win. There will never be enough money. He can't kill enough people. He'll just continue to spiral out of control. He jumped off the cliff a long time ago and it's taking far too long for him to hit the water.

Given that we all have to die one day, I'm sure most of us want it quick and easy. Poor Futarou's is long and painful.

His Dad needs to die now although he said quite a few things that made sense. If he tried, he could be a decent man, but I guess in his mind there's really no point. His callous way of dealing with his son's torment and subsequent murder of others is unforgivable. Thank goodness he doesn't yet know about Futarou's safe haven. Sadly, I wonder if he's lost this after what happened in episode 5.

One more thing... the trailers for this show are far more deceptive than they are for other shows. They can edit and splice to make us think anything...

All right. I'll go back to my igloo and await Matsuken's masterful performance next week.

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Post by Machihxh » Feb 15th, '09, 06:33

nikkibell84 wrote:I agree that episode felt a bit rushed. But, I do understand why they may have felt the need to rush. There are only four episodes left and the manga (source material) was only four volumes long. There is only so much story to tell, as well. After all, the main character is steadily going more and more insane and becoming more unlikeable with each episode. I was rooting for Futaro at first, but at this point, while I find him interesting, I do think he just needs major help.


Some Thoughts On Episode Five/Episode Six Preview:
- I wish they had shown the wedding or even the afterward. Are Futaro and Akane even sleeping in the same room?

- Futaro really has Akane under his thumb, doesn't he? He tells her to jump and she asks how high.

-Did Futaro really have to kill Mr. M? The man seemed to be warming up to Futaro, somewhat. I'm not sure about what was said in episode five, but it looked that way in episode four.

- The restaurant family are some of the nicest and most honest people in the world, and I adore them.

-I'm so glad Midori work up and grew a brain. Finally she pieced everything together. Too bad Akane's done lost her mind!

-Akane drugging Midori is just scary. I always thought Akane was a little too obsessed with Futaro, but to drug her own sister!

-Futaro throwing the money off the roof and laughing/crying was just chilling.

The episode may have been a bit blah, but it was full of awesome little moments and character development.
^nikkibell84 Did Akane really [spoiler]drug her sister? At first I thought she really did drug her but then I thought perhaps Midori was so overwhelmed with everything that has happened that she became traumatized? Or did Akane's jealousy of her sister bring out the worst in her? Perhaps she is thinking that with her sister gone, she can be secure, that Futaro will be hers. She might also have drugged her to protect Futaro so Midori's mouth stays shut as she already figured things out about Futaro... I can't wait to see next week's episode!! :D [/spoiler]

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 15th, '09, 08:05

Machihxh wrote:
^nikkibell84 Did Akane really [spoiler]drug her sister? At first I thought she really did drug her but then I thought perhaps Midori was so overwhelmed with everything that has happened that she became traumatized? Or did Akane's jealousy of her sister bring out the worst in her? Perhaps she is thinking that with her sister gone, she can be secure, that Futaro will be hers. She might also have drugged her to protect Futaro so Midori's mouth stays shut as she already figured things out about Futaro... I can't wait to see next week's episode!! :D [/spoiler]


Well, I'm not totally sure, but
It looks that way to me. One moment, Midori is trying to tell Akane the truth about Futarou and the next, Akane seems to be comforting her. Then, the last scene of them (and the previews for next week) have Midori, in what looks like, a drugged state. But, the preview also showed Akane shaking someone and screaming "Older sister", so who knows. Maybe Akane did drug her, but ends up regretting it? I'm not sure.
However, at this point, I put nothing pass her.

Edit: After carefully re-watching, I do believe
You are right. After the shock of finding out who Futarou really is and what he wants, her sister totally dismissing her in regard to Futarou, and the news of her father's death, I do think Midori has gone inside her own mind - become catatonic(sp?). Something that, honestly, Akane doesn't seem to mind at this point. My guess is she won't mind until something happens and she needs her sister's advice/help. My guess is it will have something to do with Futarou.

Sapporo Girl - awesome post.


Personally, I have never liked Akane. In my eye, she's always been very rude, twisted, and spoiled. What I dislike is her 'pity me' ways and her obsession over Futarou. She complains that people only see her birthmark, but the truth is she gives off a very distant and cold vibe. Even the kindest of people would be wary of approaching someone like that. And, I think the way she became so obsessed with Futarou after one meeting (even if he did help her) was a bit. . . unusual. Also, note that she was distant from her father and sister, and only really became open with them when they promised she could "keep" Futarou. As you said, Akane played her family, just as much as Futarou played them (and her), in order to get what she wanted.


I believe Akane has always had a very twisted view of the world (her thoughts on other people, her complex in regard to 'beautiful' people, etc) and that her obsession with Futarou, being his perfect wife and, really his world, is slowly driving her over the edge. She's always seemed a little off (the threats of killing herself, breaking the watch, her distance toward everyone, her want to be alone in her room), but it seems to have gotten worse since meeting Futarou. She is by no means his victims, and in many ways her actions are worse then his.

Futarou has a twisted view on people (both rich and poor), but he knows it. Akane seems to think her views and what she does is all perfectly normal.


Speaking of Futarou - he's said some interesting things lately. His comment on the fact that he'd never fall in love, because the people you love leave you (his mother) got me thinking, does he actually like anyone? I had thought about the restaurant family, as he seems to have a small fondness for them. But, at the same time, their "We're poor, but happy." view of their lives seems to piss Futarou off. I'm referring to
the money that he left for them. He wanted them to keep it - to show him that all people just want money. But instead, they rushed to find a police offer to give him the money.
not that did seem to make Futarou rather annoyed. He also became annoyed with Midori when she told him that
a person is a person. No one is 'Rich' or 'Poor' and that money or no, what matters is the heart.
. I'm not saying Futarou likes Midori - he's using her. But, he didn't seem to hate her, either. Or, well, not as much as he did Akane. What I'm saying is: Futarou really does seem to hate the world. He wants everyone to want money, and becomes annoyed and disappointed when they prove otherwise.


Now, all that rambling is leading to this: do you think that in the next four episodes Futarou will regain a bit of his (hidden) humanity, realize that he actually cares about someone(s), and then lose that same person(s)? Not because of lack of money, but because of something he, himself, does. To me, that would be the ultimate punishment.

Herm
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Post by Herm » Feb 15th, '09, 14:29

I also thought that Midori just went nuts, but I guess we'll have to wait and see...

I don't think Futaro is redeemable. I was kind of hoping that he would be, but after he called had the father killed about 5 minutes after the father told him how much he liked him, I lost all hope . . .

Plenty of people do bad things, but usually there is some underlying reason for it. Maybe a kid will commit a crime because he never got attention, and committing the crime is a way of getting it, etc. . .

But with Futaro, I have no idea what need of his is being served by what he is doing, or hopes to do . . . Maybe it is a fear of death? He feels that if he doesn't become rich, he will die like his mother did?

But why is he so obsessed with proving to himself that money is as important to everyone else as it is to him? Even if this is true, so what? Maybe it just pisses him off to hear people talk about "the heart being more important" because his mother would always say the same thing, but then she died anyway . . .

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 15th, '09, 18:57

Herm wrote:
But why is he so obsessed with proving to himself that money is as important to everyone else as it is to him? Even if this is true, so what? Maybe it just pisses him off to hear people talk about "the heart being more important" because his mother would always say the same thing, but then she died anyway . . .

I've been wondering that as well. Honestly, I think that Futarou thinks if money is as important to everyone as it is to him, then that sort of makes him a better person, because he knows that money is the most important thing and others pretend it is not. :| Maybe.

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Post by Shinigami777 » Feb 15th, '09, 20:03

This is a very interesting show, and I love the fact that Kenichi Matsuyama from 'Death Note' and 'Sexy Voice & Robo' is in it. I love how this character is so different from the last two roles he portrayed, which is the testament of any actor, being able to do different things with each sucessive project.

In many ways Kenichi Matsuyama is slowly becoming the Japanese Johnny Depp, in that he is very good looking, but doesn't rely merely on his good looks, and is also an exceptionally talented actor, who never portrays characters in the same manner from one project to the next.

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Post by Shinigami777 » Feb 15th, '09, 20:04

This is a very interesting show, and I love the fact that Kenichi Matsuyama from 'Death Note' and 'Sexy Voice & Robo' is in it. I love how this character is so different from the last two roles he portrayed, which is the testament of any actor, being able to do different things with each sucessive project.

In many ways Kenichi Matsuyama is slowly becoming the Japanese Johnny Depp, in that he is very good looking, but doesn't rely merely on his good looks, and is also an exceptionally talented actor, who never portrays characters in the same manner from one project to the next.

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Post by kisnyulacska » Feb 15th, '09, 22:59

What a weird episode. Most of the characters got weirdly unreal.
I mean, Futarou never was what you'd call a sane person. But until now it somehow felt like he was controlling his madness. By now his madness completely controls him. I've given up on him - he's getting worse instead of better. But oh well - MatsuKen still manages to make up for Futarous advancing downfall.
What made me kind of sad though was that Futarou
was not even decent enough anymore to kill Akanes father himself. To beat a person to death needs some guts in a way. Let others do the dirty work is just miserable.
As to Akane I have to admit I kind of like her. I haven't thought much of her until now. She hasn't shown much character until episode 5. She changed from poor, pitiful victim to determined protector of her own happiness. It needs some mental strength not to care about the fact that one is completely lied to. It might be debatable whether it's mental strength or just simple madness in her case, but I'd like to believe in her.

Midori turned turned out to be a sad person. Up until now she was always playing the strong and steady lady with character and now she's just breaking down. What a disappointment. I am aware of the fact that it is more than normal to collapse under these circumstances, but seeing that the whole series generally lacks normality I had expected something more of her.

Lucky though that
Futarou is now president. He'll gather the billion yen for which his father promised to die with ease. He might as well get rid of the maid at the same time. They're both far beyond their expiration date.

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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 16th, '09, 03:46

@Shinigami777

Matsuken has been my Johnny Depp in Japan for a long time. One day I gave up even comparing him to JD because Matsuken's his own man, which freaks me out because it's still tough for me to reconcile that he's only 23 or 24. Some of his characters have completely blown me away. I expect him to get better and better.


Back to the show.

I wonder if Midori truly went nuts or is she pretending to be nuts. Given what she has discovered about Futarou and knowing that she doesn't have a reliable friend (Futarou took care of that) or financial resources (I know he controls the bucks), she probably thinks it's better to be nuts than DEAD! I have no doubt, he'd kill her, too.

@nikkibell84

I love the way you think.
She complains that people only see her birthmark, but the truth is she gives off a very distant and cold vibe.
I completely agree because she was deliberately pushing everyone away from her. Let's look at it realistically. For certain, there must have been countless guys who would have wanted to move in on Mikuni's billions. There might have been other men who would have accepted her increasingly LARGE green birth mark as well. She decided for herself that she wanted to live in her shell until she found a kindred in Futarou. In this case, his scar, plus his willingness to be as rude and twisted as she was in regards to the watch, certainly endeared him to her.

It also took her a long time to decide she'd die to get him back. Futarou's punching in and out showed us that considerable time had passed. Clearly her suicide attempt was calculated.
Futarou has a twisted view on people (both rich and poor), but he knows it. Akane seems to think her views and what she does is all perfectly normal.
This makes her significantly more frightening.
He wants everyone to want money, and becomes annoyed and disappointed when they prove otherwise.
I think he absolutely must believe this is true. Otherwise, he wouldn't be able to live (if that's what we're calling it) with the heinous crimes he's committed.

I will think about the ultimate punishment a bit more.

@Herm
but after he called had the father killed about 5 minutes after the father told him how much he liked him, I lost all hope . . .
Part of me suspects Futarou made this final decision based on what the father told him. In his twisted, delusional mind perhaps Mikuni -san would have proven himself to have been a better person if the person in the grave had truly been the love of his life. Or maybe Futarou would have been happier if Mikuni-san had never known true love. I can't seem to hold that conversation in my head... At this point, I can't see how Futarou can be redeemed. I hope they take the ultimate punishment route because he deserves it.

Even as I say that, I absolutely love this character!

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A few spoiler from the manga

Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 16th, '09, 04:03

Please forgive the double post. I wanted to keep the manga spoilers separate.

Yesterday, I bought the Zeni Geba manga because I knew it would be different from the drama, thus, I wanted to make some comparisons. I'm not really good at reading manga because I can't stand the concept of disposable books, so please bear with me.

Spoilers! Spoilers! Spoilers!
Honestly, I don't know where to begin. I'll just throw some stuff out there. Like I said, it's different from the drama. In fact, as expected, the manga is far more sadistic. I am reading the combined first and second volume.

-At this point Futarou has killed his friend, a driver, a dog, Mikuni-san and the entire household staff (the latter folks died in a fire). The dead dog was buried above one of the victims, thus, when the police dug up the hole, they only spotted the dog.

-When "Midori" wanted a new dog, he stole one from a kid. When the kid complained, Futarou smacked the hell out of him.

-In the manga, Futarou's scar was hereditary.

- Akane's name is Masami in the manga. She hanged herself when she realized Futarou didn't love her.

-Midori's name is Mieko. Futarou stabbed and killed her right after he drowned their baby. Said baby came as a result of rape and he had the same "scar." Futarou set the house on fire (killing everyone else) after he raped Midori/Mieko. She then went into hiding and pretended to be dead.

- Futarou ran over the detective's son, but the kid didn't didn't die.

- Futarou staged a robbery with some Yakuzu (mob), but in the end, he killed the Yakuzu and tried to run off with the money. It didn't quite work out that way because other people showed up.

- George Aoyama used his name for the family restaurant.

I can't remember anything else right now as I was reading this before bed. I do know that I'm grateful most of this stuff hasn't made it to the screen.

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 16th, '09, 07:33

Sapporo Girl wrote:Back to the show.

I wonder if Midori truly went nuts or is she pretending to be nuts. Given what she has discovered about Futarou and knowing that she doesn't have a reliable friend (Futarou took care of that) or financial resources (I know he controls the bucks), she probably thinks it's better to be nuts than DEAD! I have no doubt, he'd kill her, too.
Oh, I do like that idea! Midori faking her mental state in order to wait it out and do what she has to do. Maybe she could be planning her moves and spying. You'd be surprised what people say around someone they think can't hear them or respond.

I completely agree because she was deliberately pushing everyone away from her. Let's look at it realistically. For certain, there must have been countless guys who would have wanted to move in on Mikuni's billions. There might have been other men who would have accepted her increasingly LARGE green birth mark as well. She decided for herself that she wanted to live in her shell until she found a kindred in Futarou. In this case, his scar, plus his willingness to be as rude and twisted as she was in regards to the watch, certainly endeared him to her.

It also took her a long time to decide she'd die to get him back. Futarou's punching in and out showed us that considerable time had passed. Clearly her suicide attempt was calculated.

I agree with your agreement. Akane is really frightening to me, because she is so calculated. She knew what to say to get her father to do what she wanted and yet, she pushes everyone away - making herself unhappy in the process. Yes, there would have been men after the money, but they could have used either sister. And, as you said, there must be many men in the world who would have liked her for her and not even seen her birthmark. Because, deep down Akane actually seems like she could be a very sweet girl. After all, both Midori and Mikuni are nice people.

The only reason she became so obsessed with Futarou is because he acted the same way she did - rude, withdrawn, and annoyed with those around them. Akane had threatened to kill herself before, and I agree that she planned her attempt - planned it so carefully that she knew she'd be saved and that they would bring Futarou back for her. Akane plays everyone, even herself.


Re the manga:
Honestly, I don't know where to begin. I'll just throw some stuff out there. Like I said, it's different from the drama. In fact, as expected, the manga is far more sadistic. I am reading the combined first and second volume.

-At this point Futarou has killed his friend, a driver, a dog, Mikuni-san and the entire household staff (the latter folks died in a fire). The dead dog was buried above one of the victims, thus, when the police dug up the hole, they only spotted the dog.

-When "Midori" wanted a new dog, he stole one from a kid. When the kid complained, Futarou smacked the hell out of him.

-In the manga, Futarou's scar was hereditary.

- Akane's name is Masami in the manga. She hanged herself when she realized Futarou didn't love her.

-Midori's name is Mieko. Futarou stabbed and killed her right after he drowned their baby. Said baby came as a result of rape and he had the same "scar." Futarou set the house on fire (killing everyone else) after he raped Midori/Mieko. She then went into hiding and pretended to be dead.

- Futarou ran over the detective's son, but the kid didn't didn't die.

- Futarou staged a robbery with some Yakuzu (mob), but in the end, he killed the Yakuzu and tried to run off with the money. It didn't quite work out that way because other people showed up.

- George Aoyama used his name for the family restaurant.

I can't remember anything else right now as I was reading this before bed. I do know that I'm grateful most of this stuff hasn't made it to the screen.


I was sure it was darker and even more twisted, but. . . WOW. Where do I start?

-Is the manga only four volumes? So, half way through he's already killed, like, half the cast? Oh. The thing with him killing the entire household staff in a fire is very dark. As is the thing with the dog.

-Futarou smacked a kid? So manga!Futarou seems to have even less humanity than the tv one.

- Did he marry "Akane" or "Midori"? I know he marries one of them in the manga. I wonder if Akane will hang herself on the show? Or would that be too dark for Japanese prime time?

- You know, in the series I've always felt Futarou would have rather Midori. I wonder if he'll try anything on her now that she's inside her own head. Or would that be too dark? I know they wouldn't do the rape thing, but I do wonder what will happen to Midori and what Futarou will do to her in the series. What was he saying to her, while leaning on her, in the preview for the next episode?

-My guess is that Futarou will do something to the detective's partner, instead of a son.

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Post by Sapporo Girl » Feb 19th, '09, 02:42

@kisnyulacska

That part bothered me as well, especially when he was waiting for the second thing to happen. It's really tough to sort through Futarou's psychotic mind, but perhaps now that he's got the bucks, this is the first step towards him becoming the type of rich person he hates and despises. He is certifiable. I definitely agree with your assessment of the situation. After all Futarou has done, why couldn't he do *this?* Given that he doesn't love or care about anyone else, he certainly wasn't doing the "fall guy" any favors.

@nikkibell84

I don't remember what he said to Midori. I've already erased it from my disc drive. :(

I think you're right. Even if Midori is quasi-vegetative, she could still be processing important information. She's second in the cast for a reason, thus, she must be instrumental in helping to determine Futarou's future.
Akane plays everyone, even herself.
She does, doesn't she? It's like when she fell to her knees and talked about the two of them being together forever, she wasn't even talking about love. Her version of love is rather scary and Futarou probably should be afraid of her.

Here are a few more spoilers from the manga. Oh, there are only four volumes. Believe me, that's enough.

Manga Spoilers! Spoilers! Spoilers!
- He marred "Akane."
- The father also died in the fire with the household staff.
- Futarou ran over the detective and killed him.
- The detective's son stabbed Futarou. He didn't die and the kid lived, too.
- Futarou killed a high school girl because he initially thought she wasn't contaminated by money, but he later discovered that she was. Naturally, she became a corpse.
- Futarou decided to become a politician and briefly had a fling with some other politician's daughter.
- Futarou became a governor and tried to write an article about the happiness of human beings, but he couldn't.
- As governor, he finally thought he had everything in the world. His answer to this was to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head.
- He was never captured or punished by the police for the heinous crimes he committed
- His suicide was a double-edged sword. His reasoning depends on interpretation. He might have 1) felt guilt or remorse or 2) felt that everything he'd done was worth it and dying was the next best step.
- I'm not sure if they'll broach the rape or not. It has been done on Japanese television in prime time, thus, there is a precedence. However, I doubt Matsuken and his reps want him involved in something like that.
- I don't think television Akane would hang herself. She's calculating and she doesn't care of Futarou loves her. Now, if Futarou knocks up Midori and he casts her aside, that might push her over the edge. Hanging has been done in prime time, too, thus, it could happen. I think it's unlikely though.
All in all, I'm glad the drama and the manga don't sync well. I wouldn't like it at all. I'm glad they only retained the basic story frame.

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Post by nikkibell84 » Feb 19th, '09, 03:18

I'm rather glad that the manga and the drama don't match up. The manga is just too dark. Futarou is the main character, and because it is a tv show, you do want to feel something other than hatred for the main character. I'll be the first to admit that Futarou barely has any humanity left, but. . . at least he seems to have something goodish hidden deep down.


@ Sapporo Girl

His answer to this was to commit suicide by shooting himself in the head. He was never captured or punished by the police for the heinous crimes he committed. His suicide was a double-edged sword. His reasoning depends on interpretation. He might have 1) felt guilt or remorse or 2) felt that everything he'd done was worth it and dying was the next best step.
You know, I could see the show ending with his suicide, but I also think it could end with him sailing off into the sunset or being killed by someone. There are just too many twists for me to be certain, even at this point. From what you've said of the manga, I think he felt he had done everything he could do. But, if the Futarou from the series was to kill himself, I do think there would be some remorse and guilt there. Maybe not toward his victims, but more toward the fact that he'd have hurt his mother if she were still alive.

I'm not sure if they'll broach the rape or not. It has been done on Japanese television in prime time, thus, there is a precedence. However, I doubt Matsuken and his reps want him involved in something like that.
You know, despite all the horrible things Matsuken's character has done here. And the fact that he seems like an actor willing to take risks - I agree with you. A rape just seems like too much. But, I do get the feeling Futarou will do something to poor Midori at some point. He hasn't directly hurt her yet (just indirectly with the father and friend), and it seems like Futarou is going to hurt everyone around him before the series ends.

I don't think television Akane would hang herself. She's calculating and she doesn't care of Futarou loves her. Now, if Futarou knocks up Midori and he casts her aside, that might push her over the edge. Hanging has been done in prime time, too, thus, it could happen. I think it's unlikely though.
I still do think Akane will die somehow. Either Futarou will kill her or have her killed, as she has pretty much outlived her usefulness. Or, something will throw her over the edge (Midori not waking up, Futarou tossing her away and making her leave/leaving himself, etc) to make her kill herself. She cannot, will not stay alive. Akane is crazier than Futarou, and honestly if something happens to him, I can also see her killing herself or going completely insane.

Herm
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I am Futaro

Post by Herm » Feb 20th, '09, 15:20

So I am looking for a job and I went to this professional association type meeting to do some networking. . .

I saw this lady who I know works at one of the companies I am interested in from across the room. . .

So I sat there for a few moments and plotted how I would "run into her" and what I would say, etc.

Then I went up to here and did it just as she was leaving . . . got her B card and will follow up in a couple of days . . .

The funny thing was, I could not help thinking about the episode on the boat when Futaro spots Akane from across the room, realizes his opportunity, and then plots to win her over. . .

The feeling I had must have been exactly the same I tell you. Albeit, I have no plans of killing anyone . . .

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Post by goygakgoy » Feb 22nd, '09, 18:28

really...the manga is even darker? This drama is FN crazy enough..lol. Great though.
nikkibell84 wrote:I'm rather glad that the manga and the drama don't match up. The manga is just too dark. Futarou is the main character, and because it is a tv show, you do want to feel something other than hatred for the main character. I'll be the first to admit that Futarou barely has any humanity left, but. . . at least he seems to have something goodish hidden deep down.


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Post by Kakijun » Feb 23rd, '09, 03:37

Wow what did everyone think of ep.6?
Crazy dark in my opinion. Gonna be rough subbing it. I don't even want to watch it again it's so dark.

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Post by Kessim » Feb 23rd, '09, 04:11

Ekk. Wow I literally made an D/A account to read and reply on feed back regarding the show.

I have to say that episode was rushed. I liked it though, the other episodes were sometimes really to watch because of all the music and people just staring into space and thinking. I wished they showed the wedding. I didn't even realized they got married, until the pictures of the wedding were showed a second time. I couldn't believe that the father actually allowed it. There is an eight year difference in between them. (I think) I know that age doesn't matter and its the love, but seriously, does a 16 year old really know how to love? Dx Then again Akane is crazy. i don't like how she views the world. As in 'Oh people don't really see me but only my scar" bleh. I actually think she's really pretty, if she smiles.

Feed back on characters so far:
Futarou: Wow. He's letting his madness take control of him. it's creeping me out a little. I think he threw the money because he wanted to convince himself that he wasn't the only person that is money crazy. I think he knows that he is money crazy BUT the part that he doesn't know is that money isn't top priority. Yes money is up there on the list, but there are other things that people value more.
in the end I always he him committing suicide or going crazy in a jail.
I wonder when will he be satisfied. what is he planning next, now that he is the president. I also wonder if he knows that he's going to lose this game.
Also because of my crazy mind, I want Futarou to fall for the high school girl xD
Akane: I never liked her in the beginning and I don't like her now. She's really pathetic in my view. she's willing to strap herself to a guy that doesn't even feel anything for her. She's probably going to kill herself when she learns that Futarou will never like her, no matter what she does. Or that she might try to hurt Futarou but fails. In the end she's going to die. I hope she realizes that she isn't like everyone else and what she does is not natural.
Midori ; I was greatly disappointed in her in this episode. I couldn't believe she lost her mind so easily. I know that she took in a lot of information this round (I was so happy that she has a brain and was willing to intestate ) It was very unrealistic that she just lost her mind. I've read that in this thread some believe that she got drugged by Akane. What makes you think that?

What I hope to see:

I want Futarou to grow and learn about love, friendship and etc. I'm not sure if the show is leading that way. xD
I want the maid to get a brain and take action.
I want midori to come to her senses.
;D
Um not i'm sure what was suppose to be a spoiler and what wasnt xP

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Post by Herm » Feb 23rd, '09, 08:06

My take on 6 is that I am just getting tired of this drama. . . . I don't know why exactly.

I had real trouble following what they were saying in this ep though, so I am going to look at drama note later I guess . . . when people start screaming its tough for me to follow . . .

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