Secret Garden (SBS, 2010 - 2011)

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 19th, '10, 15:36

I updated the post, love...

Who did that? Have no idea, but who came here first?

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 19th, '10, 15:46

Ethlenn wrote:I updated the post, love...

Who did that? Have no idea, but who came here first?

Huh? don't quiet get you wuv.

and YAY for Oska's pictures. OK now i am officially an Oska shipper. I loved him through out the drama but he was super sweet in ep9 and 10 and seriously made me a fan. plus, i did not think he was that mature to be honest. he was older than JW but never acted like older mature person comparing to JW.
but have to say, the whole family are bunch of weirdos. honestly, from the granddad to his daughter and his grandsons.

Ok, i am on hating mood for Seul again. as seen on ep11. she did not deserve my tiny little bit of sympathy. and now that JW mom knows that he lied about Seul to her.

I am dying to see ep11 with subs. sepcially the first few minutes and JW and Rl are talking.

s3xs1 · Post by **s3xs1** » Dec 19th, '10, 15:53

~ Edited ~

Episode 12 is so much better than 11! Enjoy!

Jav_sol · Post by **Jav_sol** » Dec 19th, '10, 17:36

Orion1986 wrote:take more liberties

To me it seems he's a guy whose always taken liberties.

Orion1986 wrote:I actually love the fact that the changes weren't huge.

Right, the changes were minor. To me these changes could have easily been the result of time, without the need of any soul swapping. Before the swap he kept thinking about her and wanting to see her. If they kept seeing each other, then their relationship would have changed anyways. I see the entertainment value of the soul swap, but it didn't do much to move the story along.

Orion1986 wrote:I don't think Oska is a hypocrite at all though

I don't agree. He showed his hypocrisy in the flashbacks we saw. He was in love and in a relationship with her. When he was with her, she was his girl. Yet, when he was alone with that guy, Oska didn’t own up to the relationship. That other guy was calling her a slut and instead of defending her ( and their relationship), Oska decides to just lie and say she’s not important to him. What kind of guy doesn’t defend his girl? Unless he believes the rumors are true. But it begs the question, do those rumors bother him or not? To me a relationship isn’t about looking at each others past, it’s about the future. No one can change their past, so either you accept your girlfriend the way she is or the relationship will be doomed.
It’s true that she left without seeking and explanation and she has only herself to blame for that. I don't want them to get back together, not because: she's too good for him or he's too good for her. I just feel it's best if they both moved on with their (love) lives.

Orion1986 wrote:I don't think they really do dig each other in a romantic sense

I agree, that's why they can be so honest and open with each other.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 19th, '10, 18:12

I think Oska had a reason to lie like that, that we'll know of eventually. You saw them in the golf track. Oska knew this guy liked her. He must have lied for a reason.
Remember, this is a malicious guy who could possibly harm both Oska and Seul to get what he wanted. Maybe Oska lied so that this guy would stop trying things.
Especially if that guy is the kind of man that is after his friends' women. There are such people. Always want what others have. Maybe he lied to stop him from that.
Remember, Oska's family is strict. This guy could have gone and badmouthed her to them just to stop things from happening. Maybe Oska was trying to avoid that.

Oska is the kind of man who even admits to his fans that his performances aren't steady and agrees he's a bad actor too. He does not lie just to get people to like him.
So I find it hard to believe he would lie just because the other guy told him she's a slut. Heck, he dates sluts all the time. Like Chae Rin. You think he'd mind another one?
He obviously has no problem dating such women and he doesn't even mind the rumors with such women, so why lie in such a suspicious manner about Seul? It's fishy.

And a random thought. If that supernatural force we saw hints of in the beginning and her dad are two different "creatures", then is this force Fate? And do we see it?
If they did choose to give it a face/manifestation in the story, that sunbae would be a good candidate. He has been there for all major events and is somehow strange.
Like, if someone were to tell me "There is this magic force trying to bring them together and who could it be out of the cast", I'd answer it's him. Definitely. He's peculiar.
This is unlikely, but if there is another "person" acting besides daddy dearest and we do get to see that "person" in a "Surprise! It was him/her!" manner, it would be him.

As for the soul swap, I do think it helped. The way things were before, none of the two was really willing to connect with the other or try to understand them.
There was so much tension that we would have had a fight and sex or a fight and a complete "break up", neither of which would have helped anything.
With the soul swap, co-operation was forced, the sexual/angry tension was taken down a notch and they both had some "bench time" to know each other.

They were headed towards a complete meltdown at a phase were they didn't even know each other much and neither were willing to even try for it or consider it.
The same thing is happening now, but now, there are feelings and things have gotten a lot deeper. They are also investing more in this "relationship" than before.
The soul swap was less of a "lesson" and more of a good way to stall the romantic conflicts for a while so that the characters can cool down and grow attached.

P.S:

Jav_sol wrote: To me it seems he's a guy whose always taken liberties.

I meant Ra Im more and him as well, in some manner. He is more used to being in her environment, both literal and social, now.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 19th, '10, 21:53

It's not only tracksuits and shoes, but also:

And I'm not making it up, this one picture was called: Like Gil Raim. Found on Naver.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 19th, '10, 22:19

Obsess much? Honey, Dol Chu kisses Ra Im when she has cream on her lips. Not all men kiss all women like that.
In the real world, if you have a foam-stache, you just look like an idiot who can't even drink coffee without making a mess.

Maybe your boyfriend will like it, but if you're spending your days copying cool women in kdrama, I doubt you have one.
Yeah, I'm being a b*tch again, I know. This is a tongue-in-cheek thing, but I do think mimicking such things is childish.

Myxale · Post by **Myxale** » Dec 19th, '10, 22:27

Strange how a drama makes the oddest things cute again!

Any volunteers to snog the froth off of her?? ;)

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 19th, '10, 23:29

Can I just have the coffee?

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 19th, '10, 23:51

I will take JW, Oska and the director then.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 20th, '10, 06:05

Greed, my love, is always bad for you...

kahlan · Post by **kahlan** » Dec 20th, '10, 06:33

Guys, this is a blast of a show. I'm enjoying all the comments you guys right. Love the part where JW found out his nick "Dol Chul (moron)". That was fun.

Issy, i also want the director and JW. Not so much of Oska.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 20th, '10, 06:50

Give me Oska then!

Hahahah, he's been endearing himself to me lately that I'm starting to really like his character. Maybe that's why I can't stand Seul girl whatserface. She's annoying really. But Oska is so adorable. Hahahahah

Though JW looks like the most adorable man ever... but seriously though, he wouldn't translate nicely into a really nice person in real life. I'd probably be ****-slapping him if I've ever met JW in real life. Hahahahaha

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 20th, '10, 10:15

Issy-kins, for the love of humanity, stop grabbing all the men!

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 20th, '10, 10:20

Orion1986 wrote:Issy-kins, for the love of humanity, stop grabbing all the men!

I don't want all the "men". Just the few hot ones that i see in front of me (well on my laptop screen to be precise). so your mind should rest assured Ori, rest of men are safe and sound walking on God's earth for humanity's sake.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 20th, '10, 16:15

Hyun Bin will sing This Man ('그남자') for SG OST.
Nate article

And^^

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 20th, '10, 16:56

Aww my two favorite people of SG

That is, other than JW and RI

I heard, from spoilers posted everywhere that 11 and 12 seems... well... seems something to look forward to

arakira · Post by **arakira** » Dec 20th, '10, 17:09

Ecchan, Sanghyun will also sing a song for OST 4,"Here I Am", right?

Maybe Ha will contribute, too? Can she sing?

Cute guys . . . Hehe they are trying to play with BL-loving fangirl hearts, huh? Tsktsk, there really is no need for that

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 20th, '10, 17:30

So I heard. I liked the song how he sang, but then again I like Sanghyun's voice. I like how it vibrates...

Damn, now this....

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 20th, '10, 18:44

Fans act out their fantasies as characters on the Net

kahlan · Post by **kahlan** » Dec 21st, '10, 01:22

janajee wrote:Give me Oska then!

Hahahah, he's been endearing himself to me lately that I'm starting to really like his character. Maybe that's why I can't stand Seul girl whatserface. She's annoying really. But Oska is so adorable. Hahahahah

Though JW looks like the most adorable man ever... but seriously though, he wouldn't translate nicely into a really nice person in real life. I'd probably be ****-slapping him if I've ever met JW in real life. Hahahahaha

I agree JW character in this show is not very nice, but he has his moments (although in real life i too may not like him very much). But i like Hyun Bin a lot and he is a looker... be still my heart.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 21st, '10, 12:48

Look here:
http://tomonari.co.kr/shop/shopdetail.h ... duid=39174
I don't think they are sewn one by one by an Italian, but...

biniBningPunkista · Post by **biniBningPunkista** » Dec 21st, '10, 17:34

Issy & Orion i am in love with your siggies!!!! Duelist had an awesome choreography, i couldn't help but watch that fight scene from issy's sig. again and again. (it felt very sensual in some way *giggle*) now this reminds me of her action stunt-woman character in SG. >_<

as for commenting... (Spoiler alert:) i've been missing a lot of episodes for the past few weeks but... one thing caught up to me upon marathoning 4 episodes: It's that scene where Joo Won told Jong Soo to never confess to Ra-im even until he dies (during the time they were still switched from each other's bodies)

that just pissed me off. it's so unfair that he wasn't fighting fair with Jong Soo who mainly couldn't show his affections properly. i do know Joo Won can't convey his feeling properly too and that he has an attitude problem plus that eccentric thinking which is way off from everyone else's, but that part really got to me. he sure was eliminating competition, even from his Hallyu Star cousin. (though we all know Ra-im and Oska is a lost cause) ^_^v

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 21st, '10, 17:56

biniBningPunkista wrote:Issy & Orion i am in love with your siggies!!!! Duelist had an awesome choreography, i couldn't help but watch that fight scene from issy's sig. again and again. (it felt very sensual in some way *giggle*) now this reminds me of her action stunt-woman character in SG. >_<

well, on my behalf I thank you dear. those scenes were just beautiful and I really loved HJW character in there. she was just apposite what Sad Eyes was in every way.

biniBningPunkista wrote:as for commenting... (Spoiler alert:) i've been missing a lot of episodes for the past few weeks but... one thing caught up to me upon marathoning 4 episodes: It's that scene where Joo Won told Jong Soo to never confess to Ra-im even until he dies (during the time they were still switched from each other's bodies)

that just pissed me off. it's so unfair that he wasn't fighting fair with Jong Soo who mainly couldn't show his affections properly. i do know Joo Won can't convey his feeling properly too and that he has an attitude problem plus that eccentric thinking which is way off from everyone else's, but that part really got to me. he sure was eliminating competition, even from his Hallyu Star cousin. (though we all know Ra-im and Oska is a lost cause) ^_^v

I have to agree with you on this. i thought this was unfair to Jong Soo too. being the man he is (unlike JW who does not take no for answer and keeps pushing himself on RI even with her strong replies most of times) he will not approach RI with his declaration of love anymore because that's what she asked him too. RI was careful not to take any decisions on his behalf but he took over that body completely and made all the decisions that suited him only and not thinking about RI.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 21st, '10, 18:31

Issy wrote: RI was careful not to take any decisions on his behalf but he took over that body completely and made all the decisions that suited him only and not thinking about RI.

Hmm, I'd like to remind of the signature with a heart. She signed everything, despite him telling her not to sign anything. Now JW has to escape somehow from those documents, hehe...

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 21st, '10, 18:40

biniBningPunkista wrote:Issy & Orion i am in love with your siggies!!!! Duelist had an awesome choreography, i couldn't help but watch that fight scene from issy's sig. again and again. (it felt very sensual in some way *giggle*) now this reminds me of her action stunt-woman character in SG. >_<

They were both damn fine in this movie. ^^ Glad you like our sigies. They put fear in the hearts of some...

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 21st, '10, 21:16

Funny SD found on Official website:

And another part of NGs:
Yes it's on Official. Yes, it requires Silverlight installed. Give me a way to download movies from SBS and you won't have to trouble yourself.

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 21st, '10, 21:46

Ethlenn wrote:
Issy wrote: RI was careful not to take any decisions on his behalf but he took over that body completely and made all the decisions that suited him only and not thinking about RI.
Hmm, I'd like to remind of the signature with a heart. She signed everything, despite him telling her not to sign anything. Now JW has to escape somehow from those documents, hehe...

She did that out of despair and having no idea about the consequences. unlike JW who did that with full intention of where is going to end exactly between RI and the director. that was cheap tactic. if he wanted to fight fair for RI, he should have not done it in her body and fight for her as JW.

misuzana · Post by **misuzana** » Dec 22nd, '10, 00:09

really liking this series ... very well put together... Just starting on Episode 2 ... I

biniBningPunkista · Post by **biniBningPunkista** » Dec 22nd, '10, 03:51

Issy wrote:
Ethlenn wrote:
Issy wrote: RI was careful not to take any decisions on his behalf but he took over that body completely and made all the decisions that suited him only and not thinking about RI.
Hmm, I'd like to remind of the signature with a heart. She signed everything, despite him telling her not to sign anything. Now JW has to escape somehow from those documents, hehe...
She did that out of despair and having no idea about the consequences. unlike JW who did that with full intention of where is going to end exactly between RI and the director. that was cheap tactic. if he wanted to fight fair for RI, he should have not done it in her body and fight for her as JW.

this topic also reminded me of that time when JW told RI that she was only thinking of herself and never had she thought about him. according to him, she was doing things that was affecting him so much that he had no choice but to think of her all the time. then during the switching part, JW was plainly killing me for using RI's body in selfish/self- preservation ways. when it comes to himself, he was being reckless. yes he was thinking of RI but not totally for her own benefit, but to relieve himself of something he couldn't really understand...but i do have to be a bit fickle with some parts: i.e. that part during the switch when RI's roommate told her how mean she has been lately. when in fact, JW in RI's body was actually trying to avoid RI's roommate at all costs so as not to be seduced and change camp. (i was laughing my ass out when he started to recite that silly turtle chant during the sleeping scene with RI's roomie in her body!)

ah... the little nice things that JW does sometimes makes up for his bewildering jerky attitude.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 22nd, '10, 05:03

Ate Ethlenn, those are the cutest cartoons. They're so adorable.

Personally I was really disappointed most of the time with JW when he was in RI body. I mean, of course it was hilarious, it was just that, he wasn't really thinking RI when he was in there. He was thinking of himself and how he would get further in the game. It's adorable, but he was pretty much a jerk. RI on the other hand was really nice and she was really nice in his body. Like mistakes she did was more due to pressure than spite really.

Like I said JW may be adorable on screen, but so far he doesn't translate well into real life.

Also, roommate of RI is getting on my nerves. Like Ate Ori said, come on, that's just slutty really. You have a man, and if you're thinking of other men (with being completely false of course on your premises, idiot girl) then you either set things straight with Secretary Kim or you dump him, because if you're going to leave the guy on the hook, trailing after you like some lovesick puppy, while you trail after someone else like a lovesick puppy, then that's just mean and evil on your part.

Still love Oska though.

Myxale · Post by **Myxale** » Dec 22nd, '10, 05:21

Had a peek at 11 and 12 at Dramabeans,and it looks like the show is rolling hard!

Just as 'girlfrieday' stated, that Ra-Im and Joo Won, are at their best with each other when they don't speak witch each other!

Can't wait for the subs!

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 22nd, '10, 05:30

http://archaenoncaps.tumblr.com/tagged/secret_garden

I'm still doing my screencap rants

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 22nd, '10, 10:09

biniBningPunkista wrote:this topic also reminded me of that time when JW told RI that she was only thinking of herself and never had she thought about him. according to him, she was doing things that was affecting him so much that he had no choice but to think of her all the time. then during the switching part, JW was plainly killing me for using RI's body in selfish/self- preservation ways. when it comes to himself, he was being reckless. yes he was thinking of RI but not totally for her own benefit, but to relieve himself of something he couldn't really understand...but i do have to be a bit fickle with some parts: i.e. that part during the switch when RI's roommate told her how mean she has been lately. when in fact, JW in RI's body was actually trying to avoid RI's roommate at all costs so as not to be seduced and change camp. (i was laughing my ass out when he started to recite that silly turtle chant during the sleeping scene with RI's roomie in her body!)

ah... the little nice things that JW does sometimes makes up for his bewildering jerky attitude.

You know what? this is actually i was going to write at the end of my previous post and now you just mentioned it. JW keeps reminding him that RI never thinks of him while he has been constantly thinking of her. in his mind, it's true. he is always thinking of her but when it comes to crucial moments he only think of his well being and best interest.

Still, you just can't help liking him. but to be honest, none of JW or Oska are bearable in real life. even though oska seems more mature and understanding. the only sane person between them is the director. some how JW and Oska characters are very fictional to me.
that's why makes this story very interesting.

and those little mermaid hints, at first i could not get it and like JW kept thinking that it meant RI. but some how i can see it clearly that it's JW himself. this role reversal shows how much changes JW has gone through.
come to think of it, he was always the little mermaid in their story. his life, his house, the way it is secluded and the way that he no idea what is the outside world looks like. I just hope that he does not have ending of original story and have happy ending of the Disney version.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 22nd, '10, 11:49

The subs are out for 11 and I'm not crazy! They DO mention Kang Dong Won!

I think our obsession has influenced the writer... Ok... I might be crazy after all...

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 22nd, '10, 12:22

Orion1986 wrote:The subs are out for 11 and I'm not crazy! They DO mention Kang Dong Won!

I think our obsession has influenced the writer... Ok... I might be crazy after all...

Wow you got very good ears. I did not hear KDW name. In which scene.?

I guess the writer is reading this thread and being affected by our craziness over him.

Talking about weirdness of this show

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 22nd, '10, 12:58

According to Nate, episodes 13-14 will be broadcasted on Dec. 25th and 26th.

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 22nd, '10, 13:05

You guys do know the writer uses Twitter alot. I know that she was upset some time back because of the plot speculation. Maybe she is taking notes from some comments.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 22nd, '10, 14:32

Just finished watching Ep. 11

I love this drama!

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 22nd, '10, 16:34

Orion1986 wrote:The subs are out for 11 and I'm not crazy! They DO mention Kang Dong Won!

I think our obsession has influenced the writer... Ok... I might be crazy after all...

Just saw it

Now i know why i did not hear his name. i was fast forwarding the ep because i did not want to be spoiled too much without subs.
and as for Suel,
it's time for her to be feeded to alligators and sharks veeeeeeeeeery slowly.

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 22nd, '10, 18:51

Why does everyone hate Seul, I don't know how far you guys are, I'm caught up, but Oska is as much to blame as she is for this giant rift that's tearing them apart.

She seemed completely normal before Oska and even when she was with him, but I can completely understand the way she is now, and Oska's diva/12 year attitude isn't helping.

If there is anyone to hate it's Joo-Won's uncle and his mother and her sister.

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Dec 22nd, '10, 20:19

Since this funny article on Nate features 2 pics from SG, I'm putting it here.
Awards for The Best Kiss Of The Year.
Categories (keke): Froth Kiss, Simultaneous (2-combo) Kiss, Eye Kiss

Viande · Post by **Viande** » Dec 22nd, '10, 22:18

Archaenon wrote:Why does everyone hate Seul, I don't know how far you guys are, I'm caught up, but Oska is as much to blame as she is for this giant rift that's tearing them apart.

She seemed completely normal before Oska and even when she was with him, but I can completely understand the way she is now, and Oska's diva/12 year attitude isn't helping.

I kinda disagree. I don't see Oska being in same level with Seul when it clearly is Seul who is clinged on Oska and trying to make his life miserable when he's trying to move on. (well he still has feelings for her but what can he do)
And as I said before, it was Seul who didn't belive him in the first place. Oska even proposed her after hearing that crap from his rival. Also being sick jealous off every smile your idol boyfriend does doesn't really help.
If you're dating idol, you can't really ask him not to smile other girls. As far as I understud, Oska didn't have anyone else in his mind at that time.
What it comes after the proposing incident, he was free to do what ever he did as she made it very clear to him that she was just playing with him and didn't wish to see him more.
I assume that made Oska more careful with women, not to tear his heart off again and so he made himself seen as player.
But of course that is just my opinion.

Ep 11:

I agree with you about Joo Won being jerk as Ra Im and telling that stuff to the director. But as he realized it himself, he's a coward. Not that it makes it more right though...

Also, about "force pairing" characters... I don't see it in that way about Oska. It's just that in dramas they tend to pair everyone (well except the third wheel...) so I'd rather see him with someone nice and not end up with Seul.
And Tae Ssun kinda happends to be only option. I don't count Ra Im as she's for Joo Won ;) But ofc I'd be happy if he found some nice random girl too.

ayu88sw · Post by **ayu88sw** » Dec 22nd, '10, 23:21

Oh my God, the writer of SG makes me crazy all the time. And it will be worse if the end of this drama going to be sad...
please don't.

This drama already more than reach more than half of 20, but why I didn't watch the way RI and JW being together?

cim · Post by **cim** » Dec 23rd, '10, 04:21

anyway,the end scene of Ep12 hints a turn for the better,or I'll wonder how could it be a happy ending in Ep20 as already broadcast half of the series and there're no any difficulties that have were overcame.
guess there will be another switching thing that could be a crucial turing point.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 23rd, '10, 07:16

Subs for 12 are out! Ruuuun for iiiiit!

kahlan · Post by **kahlan** » Dec 23rd, '10, 12:48

Wah that's fast. Getting it now. I can start watching.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 23rd, '10, 13:04

I just finished ep. 12

LOVE LOVE LOVE.

nafebri · Post by **nafebri** » Dec 23rd, '10, 13:38

hoi hoiiii...thanks a loooot....this drama is ROCK!!!^^

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 23rd, '10, 16:24

Actually, I did noy hate Suel as much i did in previous eps. what she said to Oska in that party was very heart felt.
i was commenting on why I don't see Oska and Suel at same level and my reasoning was because she is such a horrible person comparing to Oska leaving aside their love/hate relationship. But i lost my post. anyway, it seems that she was different from the way she is now and that's why Oska was in love with her. because i just could not see what oska sees in that selfish, arrogant woman that she does anything to anyone just to get her way. so i might decrease the number of alligators and sharks that i am throwing at her.

and I just LOVE the cupid guy that trying to help JW get RI. but i am starting to have a bad feeling about the director. I really hope that he won't have any tragic endings.

there is something that i wonder recently about JW, what is his fixation with Arabs?

I do find it amusing though.

Viande · Post by **Viande** » Dec 23rd, '10, 22:47

I'm starting to like secretary Kim, he's so cute with his weird facial expressions. ^^ He has funny tantrums. Ah Young should stick with him.
I also like the two ahjummas (Joo Won's and Oska's mothers). Yes, they are annoying for controlling their sons but they are also funny for their "hate" for eachothers and trying to compete on everyting.

About ep 12:

I just love the fan made pics at Viki site... especially the ones with heads switched. Caveman Joo Won.

Myxale · Post by **Myxale** » Dec 24th, '10, 08:02

Yeah, M' about to watch e12!

And I have to agree! Oska and Seul, they sooo love emotional abuse!

They make it actually look romantic! LOL!

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 25th, '10, 16:59

first of all Merry Christmas to everyone who celebrate and best of festive greetings.

ep13, omo, omo, omo
this was the BEST ep EVER so far. I think they really did the best to give us the best Christmas present. it was full of emotions, happiness, sadness, excitement and enjoyment. my heart melted in some scenes, i had tears in my eyes in other and was overjoyed with happiness is some.
and Now there is a new candidate for my alligators and sharks. JW's mom. such a evil and nasty women. I really need to see her gets what she deserve at the the end of this drama otherwise i won't be satisfied.

i have to agree with previous posters on the fact that Seul scenes seems to be dragging alot and too long. today was perfect in that term. not much of her on the sight. i think it is the time now they have to concentrate on main storyline which is JW and RI.
i really can't wait for tomorrow's ep. RI looking so beautiful and elegent entering the party and dancing with JW. i read that second body switching is going to be at the end of ep12. we'll see.
SG is just getting better and better with each ep that i am already dreading the time when is going to end. I know i will miss this drama so much. Secret Garden HAS to end with an Happy ending for RW and RI. I can't accept anything but this ending.

arakira · Post by **arakira** » Dec 26th, '10, 00:11

Sorry for the late notice, seems I can't upload the HD version at the moment.
Will put 13&14 up on monday but if anybody else can provide them, please go ahead!!^^

aility · Post by **aility** » Dec 26th, '10, 11:21

While watching Prosecutor Princess yesterday, I realised that the "secretary" of Prosecutor Yoon is the cute little singer fella in Secret garden!!

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 26th, '10, 12:30

Spoilers : My thoughts on 13 so far.
http://archaenoncaps.tumblr.com/tagged/secret_garden

As much as I love this show, the whole premise, which was the body swap seems to be kinda pointless as I don't think they learned anything from it, I just assume that it's going to happen again at some point, but they are running out of eps to make it happen.

I also still think Oska is as much of a d*ck as Seul is a b* tch, it takes one to know one. Neither one of them are attempting to work anything out , let alone fix the situation. That's my two cents though.

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 26th, '10, 13:22

Archaenon wrote:As much as I love this show, the whole premise, which was the body swap seems to be kinda pointless as I don't think they learned anything from it, I just assume that it's going to happen again at some point, but they are running out of eps to make it happen.

I also still think Oska is as much of a d*ck as Seul is a b* tch, it takes one to know one. Neither one of them are attempting to work anything out , let alone fix the situation. That's my two cents though.

yes, I also don't see any point of body swap. the story lines still makes perfect sense without it. so far, all those fantasy side of it has so significant effects of over all drama. the only thing came out of it was for JW to know his mom real evil-self. all changes that happened to both characters were made when they were in their actual bodies and not when they were swapped. I mean, it was done as result of further development of their characters. nothing to do with the swap.

as for Oska and Seul, you might be right. but so far, all we have seen is how great person Oska is and how nasty one is Seul (I don't hate as much i used to before but she still annoys me a lot. ) even if they were both at same level, we can still see some changes of goodness in Oska now. but in her case, the changes to the worst is still there. she still has to redeem herself and so far she has not. she is still using JW (even though they both know it) to get to her goals and even using his mom for her advantage. Oska on the other hand, he only used RI once for this purpose and then admitted to her after wards.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 26th, '10, 13:42

I think what I like about Oska is how he's actually a nice guy deep down. Sure's he's a player, even though I haven't seen much playing since Chae Rin, but it's pretty much obvious what an honest and kind guy he actually is. Everything that's actually bad, that I've seen, was just a reaction to Seul's own actions against him. Also, he genuinely loves Seul, and I felt so bad for him when he got angry at Joo Won because he embarrassed Seul in public, even though that situation with all three of them must have hurt him so very bad, so very much. Even now, he still obviously loves her, and I know Seul loves him too, that is obvious as well, but unlike Oska, who just wants to avoid and never see her again, Seul is doing everything in her power to make him hurt. But what does she do when Oska reacts to everything she does? She cries and mopes and be all emo about it.

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 26th, '10, 13:59

Oska has snapped at her off the bat, he auto accused her of leaking his song, even without doing anything he's been aggresive towards her, so his actions aren't free from guilt either.

His initial exchange with the guy she ran off with should of never been stated, he had no reason to say the stuff he did to that guy that she overheard, I'd react the same way if I heard the guy that supposedly likes me talk like that.

This all stems from their own reasoning, and I completely understand why Seul lashes out the way she does, and he doesn't help by acting like a 12 year old when she's around, originally she wanted to do his video to get him back, and then it turned into a revenge plan more and likely based on his attitude, which he also had the right to do based on the way she dumped him, which goes back to what she overheard.

It's one giant misunderstanding, and Oska isn't this angel as people paint him out to be , he's as much of a guilty party in this as anyone else, and admitting to using Ra-Im is still using her, and Seul isn't exactly the sneaky type and Joo-Won isn't stupid on some matters, so they are both openly using Ra-Im and Joo-Won as firewood.

Not to mention when Oska uses Ra-Im randomly to burn Joo-Won knowing how he feels about her.

I don't hate or love either Oska or Seul, in fact I find them both highly childish.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 26th, '10, 14:31

I think Oska has a lot of things were he made mistakes in, but these mistakes could have been easily forgiven and talked about if they both actually tried to talk about it. Now personally, Seul should have confronted him about what he said to that other guy so that things could have been solved right then and there. But what did she do? She acted like everything is alright and burned him when he asked to marry her. I don't know about you, but her silence about what happened and what she overheard pretty backfired because she herself was hurt by the very thing she did. If they talked to each other, or if Seul actually confronted him about it, then Oska would have known why she was pissed and would have been able to make up for it. Personally, when Oska asked her to marry him, if I was in her place, I would have thought that what I heard him say must have been some misunderstanding because marrying me is definitely not something a guy who intentionally is playing with me would do. I understand the reaction, but I'm saying it's not something that's hard to solve.

And even though Oska was wrong in accusing Seul in releasing the song, I think he had a reason to do that, in seeing that the ip address was connected to Seul's office, right? With all the things that she has done to him, what's another one like that?

She didn't do that video to get back with him, she did it so that she can show off that she's with Joo Won now. That's what I see from everything that she's done. What I can see is that Seul can't take what she dishes out. She goes all evil on him, and when he reacts to what she's done, she cries and mopes about. It actually annoys me because what is wrong with them? If they love each other so much, then sit down and actually talk about it. I think Oska has some faults, but it's still mostly Seul for me who's making everything so big and annoying.

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 26th, '10, 14:31

Archaenon wrote:Oska has snapped at her off the bat, he auto accused her of leaking his song, even without doing anything he's been aggresive towards her, so his actions aren't free from guilt either.

of course he will accuse her of stealing his song when it was traced back to her PC. we all know that she is not the guilty one here but when the evidences points at you and you are not in very good terms with your BF, you should see that coming too.

Archaenon wrote:His initial exchange with the guy she ran off with should of never been stated, he had no reason to say the stuff he did to that guy that she overheard, I'd react the same way if I heard the guy that supposedly likes me talk like that.

I totally agree with you on here. they need to clear this story further or never include it. but we are not even sure how much Seul over heard their conversation. did she only hear Oska's? what about that guy who accused her of not being innocent. if so, why she did not defend herself if it all was accusations and why would she run off with the guy who insulted her like this.

Archaenon wrote:It's one giant misunderstanding, and Oska isn't this angel as people paint him out to be , he's as much of a guilty party in this as anyone else, and admitting to using Ra-Im is still using her, and Seul isn't exactly the sneaky type and Joo-Won isn't stupid on some matters, so they are both openly using Ra-Im and Joo-Won as firewood.

Not to mention when Oska uses Ra-Im randomly to burn Joo-Won knowing how he feels about her.

I don't hate or love either Oska or Seul, in fact I find them both highly childish.

yes, that's why i wrote "even though they both know about it" none of 4 people involved are unaware of what is being happening. maybe RI to lesser extent but they all know about each others motives and reasons behind everything they do towards apposite couple. I am going to leave JW out of discussion here because he is a weird one and he is not our main topic. we are discussing Oska and Seul in here. we have to remember that Seul is the one who now re-starting all wedding issues with JW to get back at Oska. I don't want to paint Oska as an angel here but comparing to Seul, i think his character was written as a nicer one comparing with her. considering his recent actions towards RI.

as you said, I think they both acting very childish too and i am kind of bored of their story. you know well how is going to end and you know that they still love each other. as i said before, they are just making a big deal out of it. it's all based on one giant misunderstanding. so please just resolve the issues between them. at this point i don't even care, let them be happy together if they are so desperately in love with each other but to childish to act on it.

all I care now is JW x RI and how is going to end between them. btw, I think Seul is going to redeem herself in today's ep and will help our main OTP.

ps. it seems that me and jana posted at the same time. therefore some comments might be repeated.

janajee · Post by **janajee** » Dec 26th, '10, 14:44

Hehehe, oopsie

I'm not as well thought out as Ate Issy, but pretty much that's what I thought as well.

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 26th, '10, 17:18

and she did redeem herself in ep14. not hating Seul anymore. another great ep again. it's just going from strength to strength. they swapped bodies again in the middle of ep. but this time there are prepared and well organised for everything. but it was not enough for the main cliffhanger by the end of ep.

garcia_marina · Post by **garcia_marina** » Dec 26th, '10, 17:48

ep14 torrent can be found at viki.com

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 26th, '10, 17:49

Ok. Two quick comments.

More comments down the road and after my guest leaves. ^^

aility · Post by **aility** » Dec 26th, '10, 18:26

So much happening here. I need to get back on the SG train ^^

Archaenon · Post by **Archaenon** » Dec 27th, '10, 03:28

I didn't read Jana's comments actually because this page loaded first, but if you guys roundabout stated the same thing, It's more or less agreeing with me.
I just don't agree with the blind praise that Oska is getting, which is pretty much my issue.

I also haven't watched 14 yet, been out all day.

kahlan · Post by **kahlan** » Dec 27th, '10, 07:04

wah seems like lots of things happening in Ep 13 and 14. Can't wait for the subs to come out. Waiting very anxiously. Recommending all my friends to watch this show.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 27th, '10, 08:48

I'm finding the whole talk about the "bed scene" over at Dramabeans hilarious. I mean, I get the problem if someone has personal bad experiences, but come on!
The woman didn't put up much of a fight and it ain't like he raped her! We're in 2010-soon-11 by now! This is fight foreplay! I swear, lighten up already, good people!

Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot it's always the men who are the bad guys that make sexual advances on women and men who get raped/forced by women are treated like mad.
Remind me to get angry at a very beautiful and refreshing tv series next time a man "assaults" a woman that loves him and barely forces his way into an CUDDLE!
A woman who is perfectly capable to beat the crap out of him and REALLY resist if she didn't like it and also has a perfect pair of lungs to scream bloody murder with.

I didn't realize cuddling with a woman who likes you that just has too much pride to let you hug her was evil. I guess it's tough to tell when EVERY kdrama has such scenes.
I mean, all these years of male leads grabbing and forcefully kissing female leads, pulling them by the wrist, mentally abusing them and so on and so forth is acceptable.
Heck! They all even love it and kyaa over it! But suddenly, the Purity Express train arrived and we get all worked up over a sexual violation in the form of an evil cuddle...

And for your information, this particular thing in the series is VERY realistic. I watch these things with a 57-year-old woman who's had her share of dating over the years.
She's been married twice, had me and my brother and has had a few relationships. Well, quite a few. Relationships are like this. Real ones. TV makes em too ideal.
Some people in Dramabeans even say this is too much for Western standards... Are you f*cking kidding me? Westerners are far less prude and "proper" than Asians.
I'm greek and I can tell you, that's what couples do. Maybe not all, but it's perfectly normal. But how could immature fangirls know that's what relationships are like...
People really need to learn how to distinguish between passion and no's-that-mean-yes and violation and pure no's that mean "Get away from me. I don't want this".

As for the talks about the series not advancing and the characters still being the same, well, I don't expect lower intelligence fangirls to understand the story and acting.
But to see so many people not get it, is surprising. To get it, but not like it, I'd understand. Completely. It's a matter of taste. But to not even see how the story progresses?
I guess people are forgetting how the characters and whole plot were in the beginning and can't see the changes cause they happen too gradually. That makes sense.
I think a lot more people will "see" what's happening after the show is over and they can watch the whole series in a smaller time frame. Gradual change is rarely noticed.

Forgive the b*tchiness, but when people that find a man getting an unescorted woman dead drunk in every episode cute then b*tch/rant about a forced cuddle, I get real mad.
Yes, I'm talking about Mary and shows of its kind. Fanservice, treating the leads like meat and all the irresponsible behavior shown in kdrama can't hold a candle to this hug.

They're series, people. Fictional works. As realistic as they may be in many aspects, they are still one person's ideas and thoughts.
Learn to distinguish between fiction and reality, damn it. If not for your own sake, then for all the people who work hard for the show.

And as far as relationships go, learn to admit that different cultures and people have different relationships and expressions of lust.
That just cause you wish for a perfect Prince Charming, not every man has to be a gentleman in all aspects and hours of the day.
And that SOME women are confident enough in themselves not to act like blushing princesses and like to tease men and have fun.

As a modern woman, I am offended by this whole "We are fragile creatures that always mean it when we say no and wicked men should not force us" crap.
We're just as bad as them and just as good as them too. Stop using feminism as an excuse to bash a good show and a romantic scene. It's getting old.

And I'm not even going to go into the fact that each group of opinions seems to keep calling the other group crazy or masochistic or weird. That's just disgusting.
Everyone has a right to an opinion, but judging other people by YOUR standards and ideals and calling everyone who doesn't conform crazy is just vile. Simply vile.

Issy · Post by **Issy** » Dec 27th, '10, 11:30

OMG, I could Not believe those scenes will creat such a fuss too. I just don't know how and where on earth all these talk about those scenes being similar to rape and sexual harressment started.

and we are having anti-JW too
I really don't know how this people have watched SG so far without even knowing what kind of character RI is. All of us here know that she is not a type that is forced to do something when she does not want it. Even though If it seemed forced by JW, she has been always the one who has to agree to it by the end.

Yes. I read the comments there and I could not stop laughing. None of those thoughts even crossed my mind at the time. It was such a great ep that I was just enjoying every minute of it.

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 27th, '10, 11:49

Btw, ost 4 is out but no sign of the song by Hyun Bin OR Sang Hyun's "Here I am". Dang.

Myxale · Post by **Myxale** » Dec 27th, '10, 21:28

Yeah, a bit over the top with the reaction on the "Bed scene".
But since the person in question has bed experience on that matter, it's hard to stay annoyed for the sake of it!

And it really seems like the Switch was for nothing or not even a proper plot device.
It's either they Switch again or it failed as a device to advance the plot.

God, I hope it's not one of those shows that stretches thin, just to save the best stuff and pack it in the last 2 episodes. That would be overkill!

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 27th, '10, 21:59

Well, no series is perfect. As long as they don't have a bad or weird ending and they keep some consistency. I'm happy with it so far, but that's also a matter of taste.

And yes, it's very understandable to be sensitive to such scenes due to personal experience, but to say a show did bad just because of your own complexes is not right.
And it's definitely not right to disrespect other views even if you have issues, let alone if you're just doing it to agree with the majority, like many of these people seem to do.
I can't stand the hypocrisy of people who usually LOVE such behavior in tv series and praise it when they suddenly mind such a scene because it's popular to not like it.

If you don't like this scene, you'd want to hang Han Kyul in Coffee Prince for even trying to cop a feel with Eun Chan. You should hate every physical and mental abuse in kdrama.
And there's a LOT of it, if you consider such things abuse. You can't love the lack or stretch of realism in some series and suddenly feel offended by it with another one of them.

And you definitely can't compare a barely forced cuddle with rape, for crying out loud. The woman was only fighting to save face, NOT to stop him. To me, it was pretty obvious.
Not all women say "no" only when they really mean it. A lot of women behave like Ra Im would when they feel offended or just mad about something. Men do it too. It's normal.
Holding on to one's pride and propriety can often hinder what they really want. Sad that this "fake" no is used as an excuse by rapists, but the fact is, it DOES exist with people.

As for the discussion on the series, I really can't make heads or tails for this "Here I am" version. It sounds so much like Sang Hyun, but softer. But it sounds like him.
He does usually sing pretty loud, with his full volume so to say, so he could very well sound like this when his voice is softer. If it IS him, he's even better than I thought.

misuzana · Post by **misuzana** » Dec 28th, '10, 01:13

wow I'm so far behind

... A small Comment either ... He plays this role real good

but i like how he plays his girl role Oh man its funny that one Whinny Girl

Orion1986 · Post by **Orion1986** » Dec 28th, '10, 01:19

I think he managed not to make himself too girly. Granted, he was a bit more girly than Ra Im actually was, but we have to remember, the woman was panicked with all of it.
She was more sensitive when in such a situation so it's understandable why she'd be more hysteric and more fragile as well. I think they both did a great job with the switch.

Although I would have left out a couple of things, like Joo Won eyeing a girl and wanting to go into the women's changing room so badly (out of character), I still liked how they did it.
Then again, a guy having basically a free pass to look at naked women without being thrown out or called a pervert can't be blamed for liking that, even if he hadn't shown it till then.

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