Pls show me a strong leading lady

kdramafanatic1993 · Post by **kdramafanatic1993** » Jan 8th, '11, 02:03

A common theme that i have noticed is driving me crazy while watching dramas.

Lead women getting major abuse, i.e slaps to the face from b*tchy moms or ridiculous girls.

I want to see a drama were the leadin lady has some back bone and shoves these morons

off or throws a slap right back instead of swallowing her tongue and not explaining the

situation (cause there are a retarded amount of silly misunderstandings in k dramas) or

talking back!! So who else wants to see a leading lady who for once doesnt take sh*t and if

u know of a k drama with one let me know!!

Basuha · Post by **Basuha** » Jan 8th, '11, 03:26

It sad but it very, very, very rare to see a response where the lead actress is strong and don't get trample on, no that not true it visually impossible that you would see that kind of response in dramas. I have read in some post that it extremely disrespectfully to hit a person older then you and if they old enough to be your parents GOD himself when place you in "HELL" Even to raise your voice or stop the person from hitting you is consider "EVIL. Too defend themselves in the same manner that they are being assaulted is unheard of. I can't judge any one upbringing I just know I'm extremely thankful I don't live in those countries. I think K-drama have a strange definition of respect, In my country to have a adult/elder slap and berate a person due to they social status is disrespectfully, they are supose to know better and set a example. If a adult in my country act like like some of the mother's in K-drama they would be consider uneducated,rude simple put trash! In my country money get you respect but your character and actions what makes you keep it. It seem like elders in K-drama are giving respect without and condition and it lifetime blessing regardless of they behavior or actions due too the fact they are older then the person they are berating. Do they really think age qualify you to have something as precious as respect without earning it? I'm getting side track there are only 2 drama I have seen in the 7 years I been watching dramas that comes close to what you looking for "Attic Cat and "Hateful Once Again".....Sorry that about it!

aimlesswanderer · Post by **aimlesswanderer** » Jan 8th, '11, 07:27

Sadly it seems that women get treated rather badly in just about any Asian series.

Not only the physical abuse, but also verbal and mental. The pressure from society and its heavy expectations, the double standards compared to the men... that is one of my major problems with them.

rootabega · Post by **rootabega** » Jan 8th, '11, 07:45

I find it hard to swallow, too.
Both K and J doramas are guilty. In J doramas, female characters are often patronized and belittled by their male counterparts. Often, they are cast as less-than-intelligent ankle biters to a "superior" male (who, of course, they are madly in love with). Even in top-drawer dramas like Trick, where the female lead is no pushover, she nonetheless seems to take more abuse than she ever dishes out (and I'm a big Trick fan). Sadly, most viewers would think I was crazy and think that the female lead was getting away with murder and deserving of even more humiliation, rebukes, or just plain old trouble.
Over in K-dorama country, I find the physical way male characters deal with female characters just plain scary. What's with the incessant wrist and arm grabbing? Every time it happens, my stomach goes into a knot. It's not romantic behaviour - it's controlling behaviour.

nextbecks · Post by **nextbecks** » Jan 8th, '11, 08:44

I agree! especially with rootabega. I'm currently watching (and loving) Secret Garden, also with a female lead who is supposedly very spunky - but I find her such a pushover far too often! Also, acting as though all that arm grabbing, etc. is romantic is so not ok. It makes me really worried for Korean women. Is society pressuring them to think a guy forcing a kiss on them is romantic? That's how kdrama makes that look, but I'd call it sexual harassment and abusive. And I hate to think how it must encourage men to think that behavior is ok...yeah, sorry to be ranting, but this has really been bothering me. Asian boys need to learn that No means No! Forcing someone to do anything with you is NOT sexy....

aility · Post by **aility** » Jan 8th, '11, 10:21

Also successful story of a bright girl is about a strong girl, and delightful girl chunyang (if i remember correctly), and uhmm... I need to go into my memory box!

But in general, it goes both ways. you always have the second male lead who succomb to everything as well. And we have had some shows where the male has been seriously abused (mentally) by certain bitches too, soo... And there is this issue about the gender, i mean, sorry to sound sexist, but there are other ways of showing back bone rather than slapping back when you are a girl. It doesnt really give you any respect from other people. sometimes violence doesnt solve anything, in addition, there is this respect for elder, that is why both MALES and females have to tolerate getting slapped by the older ones.

rootabega · Post by **rootabega** » Jan 8th, '11, 18:31

Aility
I knew there was going to be a poster defending the "status quo", I'm just surprised there aren't more comments along this line. All I'm going to say is, no, women and men are seldom portrayed in a equitable way in doramas, regardless of age, social standing, or creed. The overall message is clear - women are not the equals of men, period.
The rest is side commentary (or namecalling or not addressing the core problem).
As for the use of the "b-word"...... don't be so offensive. I can discuss this issue without using derogatory language....are you capable of doing the same?

jossah · Post by **jossah** » Jan 8th, '11, 19:03

rootabega wrote:I find it hard to swallow, too.
Both K and J doramas are guilty. In J doramas, female characters are often patronized and belittled by their male counterparts. Often, they are cast as less-than-intelligent ankle biters to a "superior" male (who, of course, they are madly in love with). Even in top-drawer dramas like Trick, where the female lead is no pushover, she nonetheless seems to take more abuse than she ever dishes out (and I'm a big Trick fan). Sadly, most viewers would think I was crazy and think that the female lead was getting away with murder and deserving of even more humiliation, rebukes, or just plain old trouble.
Over in K-dorama country, I find the physical way male characters deal with female characters just plain scary. What's with the incessant wrist and arm grabbing? Every time it happens, my stomach goes into a knot. It's not romantic behaviour - it's controlling behaviour.

I so agree with you. In Jdramas (or Japanese films, for that matter), it annoys me that when they go out on dates, the guy walks a little way forward and leaves the girl to follow him like a love-sick puppy. I saw this several times in Hana Yori Dango and many others and it never fails to irk me. Is this some sort of way of saying that women should just follow the men's lead? I'm not liking that much. I mean, can't they just walk together?! They don't have to hold hands or anything like that, but demmit, they should walk as equals! If my boyfriend did that I'd totally go berserk on him.

And yes, the wrist grabbing I often see, too in Jdramas, but it's much more rampant in Kdramas and Korean films. I dunno if there's some sort of subliminal S&M message in these dramas but it ticks me off.

I think, generally speaking, the rash wrist grabbing is meant to show how the male lead's affection for the female lead causes him to do violent things without thinking, but I don't find it romantic at all. It is, like you said, is a form of control bordering on the abusive considering that the men do it, more often than not, rather forcefully.

Now, I won't pass judgement on whatever gender-related customs and traditions these countries have since I'm merely vaguely familiar with their culture. It just riles me up that writers of these dramas can't seem to make a consistent and logical female lead.

Oh, wait, Koshonin and Boss have great female leads. I watched them a while back but I don't remember seeing them being pushed around by their lovers or anything of that sort. They only get hit/grabbed when they're fighting off scumbags so that was pretty awesome.

I do wish someday I'd see more real bad*ss ladies in Jdramas and Kdramas. That would totally rock!

jossah · Post by **jossah** » Jan 8th, '11, 19:13

kdramafanatic1993 wrote:A common theme that i have noticed is driving me crazy while watching dramas.

Lead women getting major abuse, i.e slaps to the face from b*tchy moms or ridiculous girls.

I want to see a drama were the leadin lady has some back bone and shoves these morons

off or throws a slap right back instead of swallowing her tongue and not explaining the

situation (cause there are a retarded amount of silly misunderstandings in k dramas) or

talking back!! So who else wants to see a leading lady who for once doesnt take sh*t and if

u know of a k drama with one let me know!!

Koshonin and Boss. These are police dramas with female lead characters who won't take a beating sitting down. It generally deals with how the lead characters break into and battle it out with the men (sometimes literally, too) in a high-testosterone profession. They're fun to watch but Koshonin gets a wee bit too dramatic in some parts. Anyway, I can only think of these two dramas right now. Spunky/gutsy female leads in most Taiwanese, Japanese and Korean dramas tend to be inconsistent. At first they're really cool but then they become some sort of punching bag for the male lead halfway through. What's up with that?!

arakira · Post by **arakira** » Jan 8th, '11, 19:32

I can feel the stones getting thrown at me already, but one reason why I enjoy watching kdrama is that women and men are not being portrayed as equals.

Mostly men are gentlemen, bread-earners, protecting and respecting the family and I like to watch it. I absolutely do. I like how women in kdrama are allowed to act weak and spoiled and princessy - and i like how the men follow them arround and try everything to get in their favour.

I am expecting to have equal rights, but equal rights and equal treatment are still different =)

And...about the wrist grapping...I do find it kinda hot...cause imo there is a difference between violence and passion...and as long as it's just a passionate attempt at keeping a person from running away (which btw is mostly childish, immature behaviour, too), why make a fuss about it? If they don't stop if the woman tells them off (and I mean really states that she doesn't like it and not just acts hard to get while enjoying it) then that is disrespectful behaviour which shows the guy is a jerk...and then the woman should just no meet up with him again...cause there need to be jerks in the drama world as well as there need to be bitches...a political correct drama with only nice characters would be awfully boring me thinks

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Jan 8th, '11, 19:42

arakira wrote:I can feel the stones getting thrown at me already, but one reason why I enjoy watching kdrama is that women and men are not being portrayed as equals.

Mostly men are gentlemen, bread-earners, protecting and respecting the family and I like to watch it. I absolutely do. I like how women in kdrama are allowed to act weak and spoiled and princessy - and i like how the men follow them arround and try everything to get in their favour.
I am expecting to have equal rights, but equal rights and equal treatment are still different =)

And...about the wrist grapping...I do find it kinda hot...cause imo there is a difference between violence and passion...and as long as it's just a passionate attempt at keeping a person from running away (which btw is mostly childish, immature behaviour, too), why make a fuss about it? If they don't stop if the woman tells them off (and I mean really states that she doesn't like it and not just acts hard to get while enjoying it) then that is disrespectful behaviour which shows the guy is a jerk...and then the woman should just no meet up with him again...cause there need to be jerks in the drama world as well as there need to be bitches...a political correct drama with only nice characters would be awfully boring me thinks

I second every single word!!

I find wrist grabbing more romantic (in certain circumstances) that shoulder grabbing. Because wrist is still farther than shoulder. Shoulder is an integrated part of your closest body. I usually slap anyone who tries to turn me grabbing my shoulder. Slap with an axe, keke...
And true, I like the way they show gender differences in kdramas. Women are women, for high heels sake, whether the whole hordes of feminist writers will haunt me or not. They need to act sometimes as spoiled brats. And men are supposed to act as their arms. Everyone dreams sometimes, or dreamed but forgot, about being treated like that (you know, a man guessing your thoughts even), or traet woman like that (carry her, be with her, yes, stalk her^^).
It's a drama, it doesn't mean ife works like that. But I guess we all are watching those because those images are our own transposed desires and wishes. Because they are innocent, fresh, deep.

On the topic: Take Care of A Young Lady. The main chara is downright b*tch.

rootabega · Post by **rootabega** » Jan 8th, '11, 20:06

Hey, "status quo"-ers:

Does it feel great to throw around the "b-word" like confetti? Or pretending to yourselves that "jerk" is in any way as derogatory as the aforementioned term of abuse?
If you think words like "feminist hordes" or "politically correct" are going to silence those who want to talk about the elephant in the dorama room, dream on. It's clear a nerve has been hit.

arakira · Post by **arakira** » Jan 8th, '11, 20:20

rootabega wrote:Hey, "status quo"-ers:

Does it feel great to throw around the "b-word" like confetti? Or pretending to yourselves that "jerk" is in any way as derogatory as the aforementioned term of abuse?
If you think words like "feminist hordes" or "politically correct" are going to silence those who want to talk about the elephant in the dorama room, dream on. It's clear a nerve has been hit.

Ok, I apologize for the b-word. I'm sorry, if that sounded offensive to you, compared to jerk. My language is usually pretty foul and jfyi, I do refer to myself as a bitter b***, too. So don't take it to heart, please

And I can just speak for myself but I don't feel like silencing anyone. I just wanted to add my 2 cents. And I don't think I tried to tell anybody to take on my opinions or didn't respect any other view of the issue at hand. If it sounded that way...you misinterpreted what I wrote...

Ethlenn · Post by **Ethlenn** » Jan 8th, '11, 20:49

Hm, I'm sorry for my language.
And I was just stating my opinion, not silencing anyone. Some may don't like wrist grabbing, I like it in a drama. It's just a different opinion.

rootabega · Post by **rootabega** » Jan 8th, '11, 20:53

Arakira and Ethlenn:
Thank you for your sincerity. I also apologise for misinterpreting you. It's just my feeling that certain "hot button" words may short-circuit a more meaningful discussion. That's strictly a suggestion from me, not a command. Everyone in this thread is speaking from their truth, and I commend their honesty and forthrightness.

This doesn't mean I'll be a pussycat in the debating ring, however

Arakira, I've been meaning to tell you this for some time now: you are the reason I don't have a photo under my name. You are already using the best image of the best and hottest actor in the world - Asano Tadanobu

and I can't possibly settle for anything else. So please post a lot..... for my sake.

arakira · Post by **arakira** » Jan 9th, '11, 09:51

rootabega haha thanks!! But I wouldn't mind seeing his face around under some other names, too...maybe you can still find another image and make an avatar.

salaryman · Post by **salaryman** » Jan 16th, '11, 15:10

lots of shows have strong ladys. maybe their characters are saying some dumb things but... The first thing I think of is the show Hatariki Man. All about a strong lady who puts work above all else. However this show kind of bored me. More important than being strong I think is that the character is interesting.

Helanite · Post by **Helanite** » Jan 16th, '11, 15:36

One drama that comes to mind is 'my name is kim sam soon'! sam soon was the first drama i ever watched, and I fell in love with sam soons charater immediatly! i love her spunky, won't take no guff or crap from anyone! she speaks her mind and has an interesting way of putting things and has a bit of a potty mouth! she puts 'sam sik' in his place many times! and thats what draws him to her! I think this is what your looking for!
I haven't found any other drama's that have a character of her equal anywhere! (still love lots of kdrama though! :^D

emma-ba · Post by **emma-ba** » Jan 21st, '11, 15:03

I think Shinohara Ryoko often plays strong women. I like Anego, Unfair and Haken no Hinkaku.

skyline1241 · Post by **skyline1241** » Feb 20th, '11, 07:26

nextbecks wrote:I agree! especially with rootabega. I'm currently watching (and loving) Secret Garden, also with a female lead who is supposedly very spunky - but I find her such a pushover far too often! Also, acting as though all that arm grabbing, etc. is romantic is so not ok. It makes me really worried for Korean women. Is society pressuring them to think a guy forcing a kiss on them is romantic? That's how kdrama makes that look, but I'd call it sexual harassment and abusive. And I hate to think how it must encourage men to think that behavior is ok...yeah, sorry to be ranting, but this has really been bothering me. Asian boys need to learn that No means No! Forcing someone to do anything with you is NOT sexy....

me too
I agree

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